the word "layer" in the episode titles (this is a long shot, and has spoilers)

[omae o korosu]

this is an attempt to connect the word "layer" to the osi model. even if you don't know what that is, you might still be able to catch on here. but if you still don't know, post so, and i'll post a description of what it is.

ok, i just think it is interesting that all the episodes titles are "layer (insert # here): (insert corresponding title here)". now, this is a long shot but...

in the osi model, each layer depends on the one below it. the first layer, can't depend on anything, as there is no layer below it. also, each layer is controled from the layer above it. the last layer is only controled by the user, it being the application layer.

so, my thought is that at the end, lain reset everything, and deleted herself from all the people that knew, except alice, but that isn't important right now. since no one remembered her, she no longer really had to answer to any one. so she became the "user", because she answered to no one, and could control everything. so i guess she would become the theoretical "8th" layer. controling absolutly everything, depending on everything, yet answering to no one.

well, that's me makeing a futile attempt to connect the word "layer" to something in the real world. tell me what you think.

[Neojin]

Well..I sorta understand what your saying. But I'll address the last part of your question.

How would you apply "layers" to your own life?

I would honestly have to say that even before Lain, I thought of my life in dimensions or differnt realities...I supose "layers" could also apply.

Depending on your age and what kind of person you are, there are many "layers" to ones self. For instance, there are different "layers" in a Social aspect. School, work, church...Message Boards, all different "layers" of social interaction, all capable of giving people a different emotions, different type of control.

I think sometime in our lives we can or will progress past the point of being confined within the "layers" where we are governed or forced to follow a certain code of "protocol" i.e. School, Work, Religion...etc. This is a point were we gain control of the "layers" working within them when and making them do what we want...we become the user.

Right now in life...we are not the user. We are giving a set path with random patterns and differnt variables...but in the end we are all running the same basic program that is life.

[omae o korosu]

cool, you kinda finished what i wanted to say, but couldn't find the words for. yeah, you got it right, that is where i was going with that whole thing at the bottom.

[Killjoy]

Sounds like a pretty good theory to me, especially what with the constant underlying theme in Lain of humans being software and the world/Wired being the hardware. If Lain is god, or if there's a god at all, by that philosophy she/god could be the user.

Of course, most of the layer thing you explained kind of confused me; I'm not really a computer whiz. But why is she the eighth layer? Where'd you get that number from? (forgive my ignorance :heh: )

[cloakactive]

Your theory and argument actually sounds air tight... but from another perspective i think you may be reading into it a bit too much. I pose a question however which may toss a wrench into the monkey works. Weren't the original name of each layer longer? --shuffles through art books for porr-- :heh: I guess its time to go looking for what i'm talking about.

[omae o korosu]

Originally posted by Killjoy
Of course, most of the layer thing you explained kind of confused me; I'm not really a computer whiz. But why is she the eighth layer? Where'd you get that number from? (forgive my ignorance :heh: )

i wouldn't call that "ignorence". most people would understand the whole "osi model" thing that i tryed to tie in there.

even though this is long, please read it all...

ok, the osi model is a network model. people build their computer networks around this model. it goes as followed:

layer 07: application
layer 06: presentation
layer 05: session
layer 04: transport
layer 03: network
layer 02: data-link
layer 01: physical

now, each layer depends on the layer below it to function. for example, layer 2 depends on layer 1 to work, so that layer 2 itself can work. and each layer "takes orders" from the one above it. layer 1 can only depend on itself to work, and layer 7 doesn't really take orders from any one except the user. i'll go into that later. each layer describes a different aspect of computer networking. for example, layer 01: physical describes all of the wire and things like that that go into a network. and layer 7, the application layer, are the programs that we use. this osi model is basically just a way to organize all the different aspects of networking.

i tried to tie this into lain because it seems like everything in lain's world could be catagorized into these layers, similar to the ones above. in the real networking osi model, there is theoretically no layer "8". but some people debate about whether or not there could be a layer 8, and that would be the user. people like you and me, because we control all of the layers, whether we know it or not. so i call lain "layer 8" because she can control all aspects of the world.

sorry that was soooo long and technical, but thanks for readin' it! if you still need a little help, post so, and i'll dumb it down a shade.

[Drizzten]

Layer 13: Ego
Layer 12: Landscape
Layer 11: Infornography
Layer 10: Love
Layer 09: Protocol
Layer 08: Rumors
Layer 07: Society
Layer 06: Kids
Layer 05: Distortion
Layer 04: Religion
Layer 03: Psyche
Layer 02: Girls
Layer 01: Weird

Anyone else see a possible resemblance?

[omae o korosu]

thats exactly where i was going.

[Drizzten]

Originally posted by omae o korosu
in the osi model, each layer depends on the one below it. the first layer, can't depend on anything, as there is no layer below it. also, each layer is controled from the layer above it. the last layer is only controled by the user, it being the application layer.
The more that I think about it, the more I feel the Lain episodes don't directly corresspond with the "nested" OSI model. You could follow the titles and create a "1+1+1+..."relationship, like this:

Weird...the beginning of self-awareness is weird, unusual.
Girls...contact with the Mother
Psyche...the development of your personality
Religion...the idea of a higher being than yourself

But it doesn't seem to follow all the way through. Can you tackle this and come up with something?

[omae o korosu]

i'll see what i can come up with...gimme a week or so...

but in the mean time, i was just trying to justify them useing the word "layers", as oppose to "episode".

[Neojin]

Well guys, I really don't think there is a direct connection. Being similar in nature or setup to the OSI Model is the only connection, actual content or relation is not abundantly clear if there is any any at all.

Lain is hightech, I think its setup and vocabulary is meant to relate or hint at some sort of "system" but really the world of Lain is its own unique world with its own different kind of OSI.

[omae o korosu]

Originally posted by Drizzten

The more that I think about it, the more I feel the Lain episodes don't directly corresspond with the "nested" OSI model. You could follow the titles and create a "1+1+1+..."relationship, like this:

Weird...the beginning of self-awareness is weird, unusual.
Girls...contact with the Mother
Psyche...the development of your personality
Religion...the idea of a higher being than yourself

But it doesn't seem to follow all the way through. Can you tackle this and come up with something?

i'll post this theory episode by episode...as i come up with them.

layer 05: distortion...a sort of "dissolving" of the idea of reality.

at first glance, this may not appear to be a good thing. but how much worse would it be to be ignorant and to continue to live your life in an ingnorant "happiness"? wouldn't you rather be complete aware of what is going on in this world? this is where lain and mika are introduced to the idea of how their world might be fake, and the wired could be the real world. but mika is also introduced to the idea of the wired being some kind of after life, as "heaven/hell" are too crowded. so now they are both aware of the fact that the world they live in might not be the real or final one. so they're basically questioning what was probably the only constant in their life.

what do you think of that, drizzten?

[Drizzten]

I think you're either straining for a meaning or you didn't explain it to me so that I could properly understand it. :lol:

Taking "distortion" and spinning it into "dissolving reality" tripped me up, first of all. The ignorance you claim that comes from not knowing what reality really is can just as easily be the exact opposite...that the "dissolving" is taking away what really is reality and replacing it with something else. Please elaborate. ;)

What is the constant you are talking about?

[omae o korosu]

*sigh* i really really suck at explaining stuff. this will manifest its more and more as i post in this forum.:heh:

anyhoo, something that they have always sort of relied on to be there, is suddenly gone. they're both presented with the idea that their world might be an extension of the wired, as opposed to the other way around...so now their idea of reality is "distorted". its been replaced by a new concept, that is either the thought that the wired is the real life, or that heaven/hell are too crowded, so the wired is where the people who die go.

so to make things short: something that they have always relied on (that is; the idea that there world is real, and that the wired is an extension of it), is gone and has been replaced by the theorys presented above.

well, i hope that made life easier (even though it probably didn't), if you need a little more elaboration let me know.

oh yeah, it isn't "dissolving reality", its "dissolving their idea of reality". i just said dissolving for lack of a better word.

[katiedid]

i don't know if this really goes here but it's the thought that was triggered by reading this thread:

i thought that the reason mika kind of went a little bonkers after that episode was because she couldn't handle the idea of the wired world mixing with her world. but for lain (who already has some trippy stuff going on in her world -the smoke coming out of her fingers in the first ep??-) it isn't that hard of a concept to imagine. lain can handle it ~ mika can't. *shrugs* agree? disagree?