PDA

View Full Version : Cosmology in OMG


WelsperTheCat
25-10-01, 07:46 PM
BTW, "cosmology" is a big word we physics majors use to mean the study of the origin, current state, and future of the Universe. Sounds impressive, huh?

I promised on some thread here to lay out the order of things according to Fujishima-sama, so here it is!

Despite what one might think from the light-hearted tone of "Oh My Goddess!" and its roots in Norse mythology, the OMG universe is based upon hard physics. Things like superstrings and black holes, names like Maxwell and Schrodinger are encountered throughout the manga. Besides liking motorcycles, Fujishima-sensei also has a thing for physics, it seems.

If anything in the following discussion confuses you, I recommend grabbing the nearest willing physics major and reading "Terrible Master Urd" together. 90% of what I talk about here is revealed during the TMUrd story arc.

Here are the major points of OMG cosmology:

1. Heaven and its inhabitants exist completely outside of this universe.

Not just outside of our dimension of the universe, but completely separate from our universe and its associated parallel universes, pocket dimensions, etc., etc. We know this because Yggdrasil was able to emulate the Universal Superstring after the Superstring was cut during TMUrd. Because the Supersting IS everything in the universe, Yggdrasil could not have done this if it was in any way physically associated with our universe.

2. Heaven and its inhabitants are at least 10-dimensional entities.

Belldandy explains in the manga, shortly after Skuld arrives, that the 3-dimensional forms of the goddesses which we see are not their true forms and must be constantly regenerated or else they will fade from 3-space and we will no longer be able to detect them. They will still be there, just not in a form we can detect from 3-space. Given the fact that Yggdrasil was able to emulate the Universal Superstring, which is 10-dimensional, Yggdrasil must be at least 10-dimensional. Since Heaven and the goddesses exist in the same space as Yggdrasil, they also must be at least 10-dimensional as well.

3. Yggdrasil controls the Universal Superstring.

Yggdrasil "runs" the universe. Obviously, Yggdrasil is not responsible for the complete action of the Universal Superstring*, but it is capable of controlling the Universal Superstring. Problems in Yggdrasil often have physical manifestations in this universe. Therefore, deities in OMG have complete control over everything in this universe and their attacks, since they change the definition of the universe directly, cannot be defended against by anything in this universe. Scary, huh? When you think about it, OMG deities are REALLY powerful. Of course, they have strict rules on behavior (more-so than Washuu). With great power comes great responsibility.

Final Note: The demons in OMG have similar abilities, but don't have a direct link with Yggdrasil. They aren't quite as powerful as the Heavenly beings, but probably everything said here applies to them as well, since Nidhog (the demon's computer system) is linked with Yggdrasil.

If you want to know more about Superstring Theory, I have a long, overly simplistic but hopefully not too boring discussion at the end of this post.

* When the Universal Superstring was cut in Terrible Master Urd, it took all of Yggdrasil's processing power to emulate and reconstruct the Superstring.

So, what does this imply about our favorite goddesses? Well, their extra-universal nature combined with Yggdrasil's control of the Universal Superstring puts them on a level that most of what passes for deities in fiction just can't match. I'm going to list some gods from other series and see how they stack up against the likes of Bell-chan. :)

Tenchi Muyo (Washuu, Tsunami, Tokimi)
The goddesses of Tenchi Muyo can manipulate dimensions and pocket universes, but there's nothing to suggest they are extra-universal themselves. Their ability to influence our universe might mean that, say, Urd could get stuck in one of Washuu's devices. However, the fact that they exist within the context of our universe means they have no means of defense against program-based spells from OMG deities. If Urd wanted to turn Washuu into a turnip, she would cast a spell (start a program running on Yggdrasil) which would command the Universal Superstring to, instead of drawing in the Greatest Scientific Mind In The Universe, draw in an ordinary turnip. And that's what Washuu would now be. Not a turnip with the ability to control her devices, but a plain old ordinary turnip. Since souls transcend the Universe, Washuu would be aware of the change, just not be able to do anything more about it that an ordinary turnip could do. Washuu, even with advance warning and all her devices would have no more to say about the change than the image on your TV screen has to say about the changes it goes through.

Ranma 1/2 (Saffron)
Basically a super-powered mortal, Saffron isn't on the level of the Earth Spirits which populate OMG. If, say, Saffron were to mess with Megumi, the low level Earth Spirit guarding her apartment would have his head! Hey, even Skuld could take out this guy with little trouble.

Necronomicon
These beasties that populate so much of occult literature are extra-terrestrial, possibly even extra-dimensional, but definitely not extra-universal. Thus, as distasteful as the thought of pitting Bell-chan against Cthulhu or the "Elder Gods" is, Keiichi's girlfriend would have little trouble sealing (I seriously doubt she'd let the situation degenerate to where she had to destroy) Cthulhu and anything else the Necronomicon could throw at her. Given the nature of their attacks against humanity, it's doubtful that they could give the OMG goddesses as much trouble as the Tenchi goddesses could. In other words, Skuld would have her hands full, but would probably prevail in the end against the likes of Cthulhu as long as she didn't let him scare her to death! (Skuld is afraid of ghosts and such, much to Urd's amusement.) Cthulhu would look really funny as a turnip, don't you think? ;)

Hmm, that's all I can think of for the moment. I wrote this mostly in response to some really stinky fan-fiction I have read recently.

SUPERSTRING THEORY (in an overly simplistic nutshell :D )

This concept was originally postulated in a lecture by Nobel Prize winning physicist Richard Feynman. Picture the universe as being the image on a TV screen. Not the screen itself, but the image (picture) being presented. Now, that picture is made up of little red, green, and blue dots (phosphors) which are lit up by a stream of electrons from an electron gun located at the back of the TV's picture tube. In this example, the Universe is the image, and the Universal Superstring is the stream of electrons which light the phosphors to create the image. Now, if you can control the electron stream, then you can make the image look like anything you want. That's what Yggdrasil does. It controls the Universal Superstring by changing the data the Superstring uses to tell itself how to create the universe. Therefore, anything which does not exist outside the Universe can be affected by Yggdrasil.

OK, my brain hurts... :sleep:

iwakura
25-10-01, 09:15 PM
re: string theory

I thought the simplified model was that the universe consists of resonating string-like things. The math is really nasty and comes up with alot of extra dimensions which aren't really like the three dimensions we think of. Some are "rolled up" into really small places so we only see three, but if you look really close, you'll see the extra dimensions.

How does this correspond with Feynman's example? I'm not a Physics major, but I read a bit about the results of some of the major experiments.

At least this is an interesting post though!

:)

WelsperTheCat
25-10-01, 11:10 PM
Woohoo! Somebody is actually interested in this stuff!

*does Senbei's happy dance*

OK, as you say the simplified model (one of them, at least) describes the universe as being made up of bazillions of tiny loops of string with radii of approximately the Planck length (approx. 10e-33 cm). One string for each particle in the universe, so there are bunches of 'em!

The twist Feynman put on this was to suppose that, instead of bazillions of individual loops of string, there might be only ONE loop of string which, like the electron beam drawing an entire image on a TV screen, would become, sequentially, every particle in the universe. Of course, such a string would have to move, as a friend of mine once said, at a GOD-LIKE (pun intended) rate of speed. ;)

If you were to cut the Universal Superstring, the universe would cease to exist within one refresh interval (not long). Unless, of course, you had this wonderful computer which could, somehow, step in and emulate the Universal Superstring. :D

iwakura
26-10-01, 10:21 PM
That's helpful.

So, has anyone come up with an empirical experiement to detect or falsify the possible existance of the superstring?

Perhaps a Noble prize for that...

WelsperTheCat
27-10-01, 12:06 PM
No, nobody's proven or disproven it. However, since the publication of the Terrible Master Urd story arc in Afternoon magazine (Japan), the idea of a single superstring has fallen out of favor somewhat in the scientific community. Of course, in the field of cosmology theories come and go rapidly so anything could happen with regard to this rather intriguing theory.

As for devising an experiment, that sounds like a job for the Greatest Scientific Mind in the Universe! :D Despite my use of Washuu-chan in the turnip illustration above, I do really like her. She's in my top 3 Tenchi characters. Maybe it's that Welsper-like quality to her. ;)

Also, the Almighty would likely frown heavily on any deity messing with the balance of power in the universe as heavily as doing something nasty to Washuu-chan would. Besides, I can imagine Washuu-chan getting along famously with Belldandy, Urd, Skuld, and even Peorth - kind of like Urd and Washuu-chan in the fanfic "The Surreal World." Just sitting back and observing all those funny mortals stumbling through their lives.

I make no appologies for the Necronomicon stuff, though. Lovecraft's characters have held ultimate sway in too many minds for too long. It's about time somebody took a forest vs. trees look at Mr. Octopus Head and his buddies. When you look at them in the context of the big picture, they really aren't that scary or powerful at all, basically bullies in a preschool playground - something to be wary of only until an adult shows up. :D

iwakura
27-10-01, 06:07 PM
Gee,

We're the only two talking about this subject. Has everyone else been scared off?

Perhaps there aren't too many people who like watching PBS/Learning Channel science shows and anime? I hope not.

:p

cloakactive
27-10-01, 06:16 PM
Originally posted by iwakura
Gee,

We're the only two talking about this subject. Has everyone else been scared off?

Not really scared off iwakura... i just don't feel i have anythign to contribute to this thread. I've heard of the theory, and i find WtC use of OMG examples to compare very well thougth out. So well thought out I feel there is nothing for me to contribute to the conversation. I will say this though... I think I ran into a fanfic with Skuld awhile back using the theory in it... If i can find it again I'd post up the link to compare, but i can't find it so I'll just have to deal with it.


Perhaps there aren't too many people who like watching PBS/Learning Channel science shows and anime? I hope not.

:p
PBS is a damn fine channel... but personally i prefer TLC and Discovery. :heh:

WelsperTheCat
28-10-01, 08:54 AM
Hi Cloakactive,

Maybe I should explain this fanatical zeal :kaioken: with which I approach discussing the nature of the goddesses. As you said, the arguments I use are well researched, but there's a good reason for that.

A while ago on the Megami mailing list someone showed up asking how powerful the goddesses were in relation to other anime characters. The discussion with this person rapidly degenerated into a "who in anime could kill one of the goddesses, or what would you have to do in order to kill them." I started arguing (politely, Belldandy would not approve of flaming. :) ) with this guy, but it really bothered me that I couldn't make an iron-clad case that you could not kill the goddesses by, say, planting a nuke in the back yard of the temple. (Why would anybody in their right mind even THINK of such a thing? :eek2: ) My love and deep respect for Fujishima's characters led me to re-read my manga from a scientific point of view, gleaning everything I could from the very sparsely distributed clues therein. That's when I found that the key to it all had been staring me in the face since I had first started reading the manga. My first Dark Horse issue was the start of the Terrible Master Urd story arc. If Yggdrasil could emulate the Superstring, then...

So, now when somebody begins to make statements like "I bet Ifurita could blast those silly goddesses to space dust" I get reminded of planting nukes in the back yard of the temple and (politely as possible) jump on them with both feet. :heh:

So, please excuse my rather zealous posts on this kind of subject. My personality type (ENTP) lends itself to viewing argument as a kind of sporting activity, and I can go (and have gone :heh: ) overboard on replies without realizing I'm trampling over others who don't see words as pieces in a psychological game of chess. :heh:

I seem to be sweatdropping a lot in this post.

Well, so, is there any REAL point to this post? Hmm, have I told you that I think Cloakactive is a very cool username? Reminds me of playing the final level of Homeworld with only strike craft and support frigates. Watching 80 cloaked fighters take out a heavy cruiser in a few seconds is sooooo fun! :D

And, Iwakura, your Iori-chan avatar is very cute!

iwakura
28-10-01, 12:07 PM
re: Lori chan

I have a soft spot for the cute characters in Video Girl Ai and DNA2. There is a certain softness and expressiveness to them.

cloakactive
28-10-01, 04:06 PM
WtC: We all have our own reason for fanatical zeal... and actually i wasn't even asking for one but you gave me one. :) Very cool of you to back up your thoughts with fact. So far I have to say I have a lot of respect for you and the way your defend your views without lowering yourself to simple statements such as you stated. (i.e. "He can kill you off cuz hes more powerfull... etc etc)... You like the name? :heh: Thanks.