View Full Version : The Bullet Proof Trench Coat…
Black_Knight
16-11-01, 09:11 PM
I have seen two of these in the series… One in the OVA/OAV that Natasha Radinof (spelling? :heh: ) wears and the other in the Manga, That Bean has… How do you build on of these bad boys? And what would the weight be? And better yet, would you want one? :D
Let's not forget that when Radinov/Radinof/Ratnov/Radnov I don't know the spelling either, now that I think about it. Your version works.
Radinof's coat is so heavy that when she hangs it up, it breaks the hook off the wall. Of course, that may have something to do with the sheer amount of weaponry in the damn thing.
An army surplus cloth coat of the same size is pretty heavy. I have one and I'd estimate that it's something like ten to fifteen pounds. Making one that's bullet proof would be insane.
But I still want one. :D
Black_Knight
16-11-01, 11:36 PM
Yep. the coat hook just couldn't handle it… But it has to be more than 15 pounds… at least 25 or more…
Great timing. TFL is current discussing body armor. There are two type of body armor that is out there. Soft body armor is made up of Kevlar or other similar material like it. Hard Body armor is composed of ceramic material.
Soft body armor (lvl I, II, IIA, and IIIA) will protect against handgun calibers. Soft body armor can withstand and protect the wearer from multiple handgun caliber shots. Soft body armor will not protect against rifle caliber. If a person is wearing soft body armor and is hit by a rifle caliber, that poor bastard is more or less gone. Soft body armor is mainly use by LEO.
Hard body armor (lvl III and IV) will protect against rifle and handgun caliber. Hard body armor is heavy and cannot withstand multiple shots to it. In fact it can only protect the wearer from one or two shots (doesn’t matter if it is rifle or handgun caliber). Heavy body armor breaks apart when it is hit. This is how it protects the wearer against rifle caliber. Heavy body armor is mainly use by military and special LEO, i.e. SWAT. BTW if someone gets hit with a rifle caliber bullet and is wearing hard body armor that person will most likely be in shock and go unconscious due to the burnt trauma the body received. The rifle bullet will not penetrate but the energy that is transfer to the body by the bullet will break some bones and tear soft tissue inside the body.
National Institute of Justice: They are the ones that do the body armor standard. It is in PDF format. All the information you need to know about body armor and what it can stop and not stop is in this file.
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/nij/pubs-sum/183651.htm
You can go here to get a really quick break down of the NIJ standard.
http://bulletproofme.com/Ballistic_Protection_Levels.shtml
This is the current thread in TFL that discus body armor.
http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=84413
TheFireline.com is the premier firearms forum on the Internet.
http://thefiringline.com/
It is not illegal to buy body armor in the USA. If you have the money to spend you can buy ballistic clothing (Jackets and underwear vest) or vest from:
http://bulletproofme.com/
http://www.secondchance.com/
http://www.uscav.com/
or you can go to a gun show. There is always someone in the show that sell body armor.
Black_Knight
17-11-01, 01:44 AM
Originally posted by Fred
Hard body armor (lvl III and IV) will protect against rifle and handgun caliber. Hard body armor is heavy and cannot withstand multiple shots to it. In fact it can only protect the wearer from one or two shots (doesn’t matter if it is rifle or handgun caliber). Heavy body armor breaks apart when it is hit. This is how it protects the wearer against rifle caliber. Heavy body armor is mainly use by military and special LEO, i.e. SWAT. BTW if someone gets hit with a rifle caliber bullet and is wearing hard body armor that person will most likely be in shock and go unconscious due to the burnt trauma the body received. The rifle bullet will not penetrate but the energy that is transfer to the body by the bullet will break some bones and tear soft tissue inside the body.
Might I ask what usefulness this type of armor is, more than only protecting you from rifle shots… And then it might cause internal injuries…?
The military and special LEO use hard body armor to protect themselves from rifle caliber bullets. Soft body armor will not protect them from a rifle caliber bullet. A rifle caliber bullet will treat soft body armor like regular clothing. Soft body armor is not design to stop rifle caliber bullets.
The hard body armor does not cause internal injury to the wearer if it is hit. It is the transfer of energy by the rifle bullet to the body that causes the internal injuries.
Burnt trauma accrues when a bullet hit a person wearing protective clothing, i.e. body armor. Burnt trauma is different between handgun and rifle calibers. Handguns calibers do not have that much energy to transfer to the body nor the speed to effectively help transfer the energy to the body. The different bullet shape between a handgun and rifle caliber can make a big difference on how energy is transfer to the body. When a person is hit by a handgun caliber while wearing soft body armor, that person can return fire. The person is in a great deal of pain but it is unlikely that that person will go unconscious.
On the other hand a rifle does have the energy and speed to effectively transfer its energy to the human body. When a hard body armor stop a .308 (7.62x51) going at a speed of 2690ft and with the energy of 2363 (ft/lbs), that energy has to go somewhere. That is a lot of energy that is transfer to the body and in most cases it will cause shock.
Here are common stats between a handgun caliber and rifle caliber at a range of 50 yards.
45 ACP 230 gr. Supreme SXT.
Speed. 846
Energy. 366
http://www.winchester.com/ammunition/store/cfhlist.eye?cartlist=NDUgQXV0b21hdGlj&uselist=none&brandlist=none&image=on&summary=on&velocity=on&energy=on&traj=on
7.62x51mm (.308) 147 gr. USA FMJ
Speed. 2690
Energy. 2363
http://www.winchester.com/ammunition/store/cfrlist.eye?cartlist=Ny42Mng1MW1t&uselist=none&brandlist=none&image=on&summary=on&velocity=on&energy=on&shortrange=on&longrange=on
Notice the difference?
I use Winchester website to get the stats.
http://www.winchester.com/
Black_Knight
17-11-01, 03:08 AM
I knew that the force of the bullet is what would cause the internal damage… But aside from only protecting one or two shots… Heavy body armor… Doesn't seem that great… At least to me…
orochi X
17-11-01, 03:12 AM
it wiegh alot and if u wanted 1 u can always make it yourself
I think Radinof has kevlar under her shirt too, it looks really similar to Rally's sillhouette when she's wearing the kevlar. Just a little bit more bulky than you would expect from an anime, y'know what I mean? (No, you all think I'm crazy. Moving right along.) Of course, that must weigh a friggin' ton, but whatever.
what i want to know is where did becky and the news reporter get THAT jacket to use to fool the politician in the boardroom to spill his guts on camera. radinov still had hers on didn't she?:confused:
Radinof did still have her coat on, but you don't think the self proclaimed "Incredible" Becky could get herself a coat that looked just like it in such a short time? And it wasn't a reporter it was a police woman, you remember from when Rally and Minnie and Becky were being warned by Roy right before they found the knife in the Cobra?
Anyway, the coat could well be similar- it's actually not an uncommon design. Of course, I've never seen a bullet proof one, but I see leather jackets with a colonial militaristic motif in the shops here in Portland every other day. For, like, two hundred dollars, otherwise I would be wearing one.
Black_Knight
17-11-01, 12:34 PM
It was most likly a Mass Production model of the trench coat that was modified Radinof…-Now I really want that knife too… :D :heh:
Butters
17-11-01, 08:44 PM
I'll take this opportunity to mention, once again, how ---- of a hitman [woman, rather] Radinov is. If she didn't have that damn coat, she would have long been dead, just charging into that house with a couple of Uzi's :rolleyes:
Another thing, what were those retards in the surveillence room doing? They just watched one of their team get knifed and they just let her come in...
Maybe she became a successful hitwoman because all her targets were retards, except Rally and May, of course ;)
Originally posted by Black_Knight
I knew that the force of the bullet is what would cause the internal damage… But aside from only protecting one or two shots… Heavy body armor… Doesn't seem that great… At least to me…
To you it might be but to people that their life depend on it is a blessing. Body Armors (soft or hard) are discarded once it has been damage. It doesn't matter if its one or 10 ten bullets. No one should use damage body armors. Your life is worth more then that.
Hard body armor is the only armor that can be wear and still move at a reason pace. It is the only personal armor that can stop a rifle bullet. Like they said it is better then nothing.
Didn't a shotgun hit Radinov? If that is the case she should be unconscious. A lvl IIIA soft body armor will protect her from a Shotgun shell but the energy it gives off will be like a rifle caliber bullet.
Originally posted by Fred
Didn't a shotgun hit Radinov? If that is the case she should be unconscious. A lvl IIIA soft body armor will protect her from a Shotgun shell but the energy it gives off will be like a rifle caliber bullet.
yeah, but the energy would be spread in a pattern of round shot compared to a single sharp point of a rifle shot.;)
Black_Knight
18-11-01, 02:26 AM
Originally posted by Fred
Didn't a shotgun hit Radinov? If that is the case she should be unconscious. A lvl IIIA soft body armor will protect her from a Shotgun shell but the energy it gives off will be like a rifle caliber bullet.
Besides that… This is an anime… :rolleyes2
It's an anime, yes, but one thing you can count on from Gunsmith Cats is the sheer realism of the weaponry. Sonoda did a lot of research for the series. (Except the cars. I mean, it's a real car but in Bonnie and Clyde the driver's side is the wrong side for the first two issues) It makes me wonder what the hell was up with that lovely, wonderful quote.
Nobody else had an urge to marry Radinof after that?
Angels Decay
18-11-01, 09:37 AM
But I *LOVE* the knife :evil:
Black_Knight
18-11-01, 03:01 PM
Well take out the green… And she is on sexy mamma… :D
Originally posted by MP2100
yeah, but the energy would be spread in a pattern of round shot compared to a single sharp point of a rifle shot.;)
Not really. Go look at your body. There is not much area in the body. The human body is very compact.
A 00 Buck can contain up to 15 pallets. Going at a speed up to 1500 ft/sec all hitting the body at the same time. If a person with body armor get hit with a 00 Buck, that person won't be doing that much back. The person will be in a great deal of pain if not unconscious. Basically if you get hit by a shotgun (buck or slug) you won’t be getting up, armor or no armor.
Shotshells stats:
http://www.remington.com/ammo/PAGES/shotshell/shotshell.htm
Originally posted by KtHM
It's an anime, yes, but one thing you can count on from Gunsmith Cats is the sheer realism of the weaponry. Sonoda did a lot of research for the series. (Except the cars. I mean, it's a real car but in Bonnie and Clyde the driver's side is the wrong side for the first two issues) It makes me wonder what the hell was up with that lovely, wonderful quote.
Nobody else had an urge to marry Radinof after that?
When they translated to US, they had to flip/reverse the image. Right is left and left is right. That is why you see the driver side in the wrong area because of the flip.
As for Kenichi Sonoda realism of the weaponry, all I can say is that he is very detail on the drawing of firearms. Unfortunately he doesn’t know that much about firearms and tactics.
Still Gunsmith Cats is a great read and I do enjoy it a lot.
Whatever. I still think Radinov is one hot-momma. Especially before she cuts her hair really, really, short, though that is sexy in it's own respect. (Says the raging bi-sexual. Me like butch!) What can I say? Radinov really, really appealed to me.
Black_Knight
18-11-01, 10:13 PM
Fred… I bet Kenichi Sonoda knew what he was doing… Leave the man be…
No he doesn't. What is his experience in small arms? I doubt he has any. He can’t even own a gun in his own county. How can someone have experience in small arms if they don’t even own or fire a gun. It’s like the blind leading the blind.
They had a trip over to america and test weapons there.
Another thing to remember would be these are police issue weapons. Not as powerful as normal ones. The shot gun was probably using rubber peletes and less powder than standard shells. But admitadly it should have done more to her...
Its in another thread....
Do you mean beanbags? Yes beanbags are use in situation where lethal force is not needed. All police’s shotgun are chamber in 00 buck or slug. Beanbags are not something they carry in their police cars.
Going to a three day field trip does not make them a gun expert.
Black_Knight
19-11-01, 09:49 PM
Originally posted by Fred
Do you mean beanbags? Yes beanbags are use in situation where lethal force is not needed. All police’s shotgun are chamber in 00 buck or slug. Beanbags are not something they carry in their police cars.
Going to a three day field trip does not make them a gun expert.
Man… Are you some type of NRA Fanatic? I mean this much devotions is… Well… Er… Uncanny…
Actually it quiet normal.
Black_Knight
20-11-01, 12:08 AM
So you are a member of the NRA then…
The Captain
20-11-01, 02:38 PM
I don't think there's anything unusual or out of the ordinary of having a decent knowledge of firearms. Just because someone has some knowledge, don't assume that they're in the NRA. And what does it matter if he is? Anyways, I've never heard of rubber shottie pellets. I've only seen beanbags in use (on tv) when the police tried to subdue a katana wielding psycho guy.
Black_Knight
20-11-01, 07:13 PM
Originally posted by The Captain
I don't think there's anything unusual or out of the ordinary of having a decent knowledge of firearms. Just because someone has some knowledge, don't assume that they're in the NRA.
I have a wide knowledge of guns and even little info on gunsmithing… And I'm not a member of the NRA… But Freds devotion is…-er… Fanatical…
Yes I am an NRA and GOA. The NRA compromise way to much IMO.
Calling me fanatical mean that you really got brainwash by the liberal media. What is the difference between a person that like anime and a person that like guns? Should we categorize all anime lovers as sex fiends?
Let me tell you something. There are over 250 million guns in the USA. One in three household in the USA has a least one firearm. There are over 10 million NRA members. This does not include other organization. Most of these members vote in election days.
Unlike what you might think, the NRA and other organization like it does represent the majority of Americans. Compare to HCI (handgun Control Inc.), which most of their members are not Americans citizens and their money comes from overseas. The HCI and other organization like it are in near bankruptcies or bankrupted (MMM and Brady Campaign).
Your and Sonoda knowledge of firearms IMO come from mostly watching action movies. The truth is that there is not a single movie that actually portrays firearms usage. None at all. What I was trying to do is to tell you the truth, to open your eyes.
One last thing about Sonoda so called research. Bail Bondman, also known as Bounty Hunters are ban in the State of Illinois since 1963. In other words there hasn’t been a bounty hunter in the Illinois since 1963. Conceal Carry is ban in the State of Illinois. In other words, if you get caught concealing a handgun you will get 5-15 years in jail.
National Association of Bail Insurance Companies
http://www.nabic.net/
Illinois Statute on Bounty Hunters
http://www.nabic.net/Bounty%20Hunter%20Laws.htm
Packing.org: Information and Laws Concerning Conceal Carry by State
http://www.packing.org/states.jsp
Black_Knight
22-11-01, 03:43 PM
:|
Man… Their is just no pleaseing some people…
What are you trying to please? Your comments was a direct attack toward me. Calling me fanatical is uncall for.
Black_Knight
22-11-01, 03:47 PM
I mean that you love to be presise on many items…
I never said you were brainwashed people…
That was an uncalled for assumption… Now can we just get on with life? Friends?
Next time don't call people fanatical or crazy if you don't disagree with them. Choosing the right words will save you a lot of trouble, friend.
Black_Knight
22-11-01, 04:10 PM
Well, don't jump to conculstion either… My dear friend…
Wolfpac
22-11-01, 11:19 PM
Well back to the orignal Topic, I think Bean's jacket is better. He got Shot with armour pearcing bullets and he still survied. And Misty nearly broke her foot on his jacket. But just one thing, Bean Bandit had a Bulletproof Bandana, is that possible??? I mean, wouldn't it just fall off his head every 2 minutes???
Black_Knight
22-11-01, 11:23 PM
He had it tied on really tight! :D
He is the Bean Badit after all! :D
if you shot him in the Bandana his skull would shatter anyway. not really useful.
sounds great though:cool: :lol:
Black_Knight
23-11-01, 01:49 AM
He's the Bean Badit! He can stand up to that!
MauveVandal
24-11-01, 06:30 PM
Bean Bandit, what does it do steal beans if so what kind, is it the kind that make you fart, or vomit? Either way, I want a trench coat that is bullet proof along with a, Colt M1911, Heckler & Koch USP, Desert Egale .50 Action Express, and a Rally Vincent.
Dryden-san
25-11-01, 11:21 PM
Originally posted by Wolfpac
Well back to the orignal Topic, I think Bean's jacket is better. He got Shot with armour pearcing bullets and he still survied. And Misty nearly broke her foot on his jacket. But just one thing, Bean Bandit had a Bulletproof Bandana, is that possible??? I mean, wouldn't it just fall off his head every 2 minutes???
Yes, but he shouldn't have survived the armor piercing bullets. Or so I would assume. What with them being armor piercing bullets, and everything. Likewise, while I suppose you could make a bandanna out of bulletproof material, it wouldn't look like Bean Bandit's bandanna. T'would be thick, bulky, and not very, uh-bandanna like. In his OAV I believe he disables a car by repeatedly ramming it with his shoulder. Bean Bandit is just too badass to die; he can drive a salom at 150 mph, and you gotta respect that. But the point is, for all the detailing on the firearms, GSC is an action anime/manga with only a passing resemblance to reality. If it wasn't, than everyone would be dead by the end of the first volume.
Black_Knight
26-11-01, 12:07 AM
Originally posted by MauveVandal
Bean Bandit, what does it do steal beans if so what kind, is it the kind that make you fart, or vomit? Either way, I want a trench coat that is bullet proof along with a, Colt M1911, Heckler & Koch USP, Desert Egale .50 Action Express, and a Rally Vincent.
http://www.plaudersmilies.de/sad/annoyed.gif
That explains it all…
From what I figure Bean's bandit is wearing Type IV body armor. Type IV is ceramic armor, which is very heavy and uncomfortable. No one will wear Type IV body armor unless they have to. It is possible that a Type IV body armor drop from that high can injure someone foot. Type IV body armor will protect up to a 30-06 AP round. Please note that if you get hit buy a rifle round you are mostly like to go into shock and won’t be doing that much.
http://bulletproofme.com/Ballistic_Protection_Levels.shtml
I have never seen a Bulletproof Bandana. Kevlar and other material like it does not bend well.
as i said before, having the bandana right up against your head, the impact of the round would shatter your skull and turn your brain into mush....wouldn't be much use then.....:(
The chapps we use in the SES (State Emergency Service for those unfamiliar with us) to protect the lower half of our bodies from chainsaw accidents are made from kevlar fibres, and they're just like ordinary cloth. While they won't stop a bullet, they will protect your legs should the chain ever break off the saw.
I haven't seen the manga or the Riding Bean OAV, and I could be wrong, but maybe the bandana's just to protect his head from shrapnel.
I have to make a correction on my last post. From the looks of Bean Bandit's bulletproof bandana, the Kevlar is broken into sections thus enabling him to bend it. I guess it is possible to make a bulletproof bandana by breaking the Kevlar into section and encasing it in cloth. Not a bad idea actually.
I still love the part where he gets shot in the head and he starts for fall back and then comes forward because of the bandana. When I saw that I knew then that I needed to get myself a Bean Bandit. No, not a plushie. I needed like... Bean Bandit. In my living room. Right then.
Black_Knight
27-11-01, 10:42 PM
This man is the Bean Badit, Man! You pump a shotgun shell into his chest… I bet he wouldn't even flinch! He'd take that shot gun… Break it in half… And then shove it into oppestet ends of your body… I mean this man is tough as nails… So we don't have to be all critical about it…
LunarWhirlwin
12-01-02, 04:43 PM
I think bean mentioned Ceramic plating kevlar and even chain maile involved in the armor of his jacket.
Woven in somewhere, Now considering that someone like bean wouldn't use a 4-in-one pattern but more likely a 6 or 8-in-one chain maile weaving, and that would mostlikely come up to be at least 3/4 inch thick, and made of galvanized steel, it would probably be a deterent as well.
With this in mind on top of the other forms of body armor involved, I'd say falling on someones foot would definately cause you a world of pain.
Black_Knight
12-01-02, 08:26 PM
Originally posted by LunarWhirlwin
I think bean mentioned Ceramic plating kevlar and even chain maile involved in the armor of his jacket.
Woven in somewhere, Now considering that someone like bean wouldn't use a 4-in-one pattern but more likely a 6 or 8-in-one chain maile weaving, and that would mostlikely come up to be at least 3/4 inch thick, and made of galvanized steel, it would probably be a deterent as well.
With this in mind on top of the other forms of body armor involved, I'd say falling on someones foot would definately cause you a world of pain.
Well, the weight must be at least 100 pounds…
Originally posted by LunarWhirlwin
I think bean mentioned Ceramic plating kevlar and even chain maile involved in the armor of his jacket.
Woven in somewhere, Now considering that someone like bean wouldn't use a 4-in-one pattern but more likely a 6 or 8-in-one chain maile weaving, and that would mostlikely come up to be at least 3/4 inch thick, and made of galvanized steel, it would probably be a deterent as well.
Chain mail won’t even stop a handgun bullet. If you’re going with metal you need at least 1.5inch (38.1mm) armor plate to stop a rifle bullet. I shoot a lot of metal plates with my rifles (7.62x39, 7.62x54R, 5.56x45, etc) and trust me they will tear up an 1inch (25.4mm) plate.
The reason why the went with ceramic because it break and redirect the force of the bullet.
LunarWhirlwin
13-01-02, 03:18 PM
I was just saying what I recall... but he mentioned all three in that coat of his... go figure.
My comments weren’t directed at you. I was pointing out some facts . :D :)
Black_Knight
05-04-02, 10:26 PM
Just read up on some of his other explots… Seems Bean has more than one Jacket, found out in Misty's Run… So it's not all type IV…
Yeah he got a whole lot of armor.
Black_Knight
05-04-02, 11:34 PM
Originally posted by Fred
Yeah he got a whole lot of armor.
Jesus! Where did you come from? I thought you vanished!
I was out for a few weeks. I just came back home and started to post a week back. I posted in the Cowboy bebop, Trigun, and this board. Glade to hear that I am miss.
Bahamut
23-06-02, 04:51 AM
For what I remember Bean's coat is made of horse hide for the external layer plus various layer of Kevlar with a chainmail placed in the middle. It is also said that the whole thing weighs about the same as May, so it's reasonably to assume it wheighs around fifty kilos. I think that this arrangement is made to get the best protection against both bullet and edged weapon
Wolfpac
23-06-02, 12:03 PM
I think Bean is in the wrong profession. I think he would be perfect for "The World's Strongest Man" Contest.
Black_Knight
23-06-02, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by Wolfpac
I think Bean is in the wrong profession. I think he would be perfect for "The World's Strongest Man" Contest.
Or the best stamina... He was once vampired of god know how many quartes of blood, and literaly fell asleep at the wheel... A direct hit to his balls from Minni May was the thing to woke him up and I think she fracured her hand doing it! :D
he probably had a steel plate protecting his assets.
Wolfpac
24-06-02, 01:02 PM
I think if any guy got their balls handled by Minnie-May, they would be sure to wake up. Even if your in a Coma.
Originally posted by Bahamut
For what I remember Bean's coat is made of horse hide for the external layer plus various layer of Kevlar with a chainmail placed in the middle. It is also said that the whole thing weighs about the same as May, so it's reasonably to assume it wheighs around fifty kilos. I think that this arrangement is made to get the best protection against both bullet and edged weapon
Kevlar won't protect you from rifle calibers. Chain mail will protect against edge weapons but not pistol or rifle calibers rounds. The best protection against both edge weapon and rifle calibers round is to buy Type III or IV hard body armor but they weight over 22 pounds (9.97 kg). Hard body are compose mostly of ceramic because when a bullet hit it it will break instead bending like steel (which is bad because instead of the bullet entering you it will be the steel plate).
Anyway if you want to buy a bullet proof vest just go here
http://bulletproofme.com/index.shtml
it wasent designed for that. If you think about it all he really has to deal with are subs and pistols.
Bahamut
26-06-02, 10:32 AM
Ok I know that kevlar alone would not protect from rifle bullet.
Given that Bean jacket weighs a lot over 22 pounds and given the impraticability of it in real life I think it could be assumed that several layer of Kevlar backed on a chainmail could resist a rifle shot which has alredy gone through a car door. Plus for what is seen in the manga rifle shot get past Bean's jacket which is only famed to resist to them.
Doesn’t matter how many layers of Kevlar you have on, if the car door couldn’t stop the rifle round you are sh*t out of luck. Soft body armor (Kevlar) is not design to stop a rifle caliber rounds at all. It doesn’t matter if you have three layers or 300 hundred layers of Kevlar on the rifle round will penetrate it.
A body armor is useless if it can’t stop the bullet. I cannot stress that enough. If a bullet enters the chest and hit a vital organ it is all over. That is why people are taught to aim at the chest and not any place else.
Body armor is uncomfortable to wear especially in the summer time.
Half the point of body armour is to DEFLECT the shot. Not stop it. Sometimes thats enough to allow some one to survive the hit.
Black_Knight
26-06-02, 10:54 PM
Originally posted by death
Half the point of body armour is to DEFLECT the shot. Not stop it. Sometimes thats enough to allow some one to survive the hit.
Correct, I mean after Bean went toe-to-toe with that automatic rifle, he was still rather banged up, the bullets penitrated, but they were slowed down and/or deflected, that is the main point of body armor… Also, he has multipul coats as well… So they mught vary from, coat to coat…
Originally posted by death
Half the point of body armour is to DEFLECT the shot. Not stop it. Sometimes thats enough to allow some one to survive the hit.
Soft body armor does not “deflect” bullets. What Kevlar does is catch the pistol bullet and slow (stop) it down. I always get a laugh when people think that Teflon coated bullets are AP. In fact Teflon decrease the chance of a pistol caliber bullet penetrating because it help the Kevlar grip the bullet better.
You probably wondering why rifle calibers can penetrate soft body armor and not pistol calibers. It is how the bullet and cartridge is design.
Rifle bullets are smaller and lighter then their pistol calibers counterparts but rifle cartridge hold more powder then pistol cartridge.
Example:
9mm (.38 inch in diameter of the bullet or .38 cal) standard Nato pistol cartridge: Wight 124 grain (8 gram) and contains 4.2 grain (.26 gram) of powder.
5.56x45 (.22 inch in diameter of the bullet or .22 cal.) standard Nato rifle cartridge: Wight 55 grain (3.5 gram) and contains 25 grain (1.61 gram) of powder.
Notice the big difference. Rifle bullets are lighter and contain more gunpowder, which translate to a faster bullet and pack a lot of energy. Not only that rifle have long barrel (20+ inch) then pistol barrel (5 inch or less). What this means is that rifles utilize the gas much better, which translate into better accuracy and longer range then pistols. If a person gets hit by a rifle bullet the person tissue will be liquefy which will then cause shock to the body. In other words, that person will be on the ground in no time unless the person is using drugs.
Another thing that separated between rifle and pistol bullet is the shape. Pistol bullets have more facial area then rifle bullets. In other words rifle bullets are pointed and pistol bullets are round. We all know that pointed objects will penetrate better then round ones.
Here is a little tidbit. When a person gets hit in the front, the person won’t fly backward. A 124 grain bullet would not move a 2 pounds object much less a 150 pounds person. What would happen is the person will fall forward because the center of gravity for human is forward. The bullet will either stay in the body (pistol caliber) or pass right through the body (rifle caliber). One of the ways detectives can tell if the body has been temper is the back is facing the ground and not the belly. I needed to get this out of my system because a few days back I saw Blackhawk down. When a soldier get hit in the front they fly backward which annoy the hell out of me.
Originally posted by Black_Knight
but they were slowed down and/or deflected, that is the main point of body armor
That is not actually true. Most bullets are made with a lead core, which is contained in a copper jacket. When the bullet hit a hard object like steel (did not penetrate), the bullet will bend (dent) the steel and disintegrate (lead will deposit on the steel because lead is soft). If a bullet contain a hard core like steel (steel core) or Tungsten (AP) and hit a hard object like steel (and not penetrate), it will embed itself into the steel. Check the attachment out.
Black_Knight
28-06-02, 02:13 AM
The exit and the latter was the enterance?
The first picture (ap_test1_wsm.jpg) is the entrance. It shows the back of the bullet where the copper jacket is destroyed when it made contact with the hard steel. What is left of the bullet is the core, which is made out of Tungsten (it is a metal that is commonly use for AP bullets. If you want to learn more go to google.com and type in Tungsten Metal).
The second picture (ap_test3_wsm.jpg) shows the tip of the Tungsten core bullet almost penetrated (exit) the steel plate. The Tungsten core kept most of its shape because Tungsten is stronger/harder then steel.
Steel core is not considered AP (unless it is used in pistol caliber. Kevlar cannot stop pistol bullets that contain steel core or any hard metal) will penetrate less then Tungsten but more then lead core. Steel core bullet will deform when hitting steel plates but not disintegrate like lead core bullets.
Here is another tidbit. The reason why the media thinks that Teflon made a bullet AP is because they misunderstood KTW bullets (which is mention in Gunsmithcats manga). The KTW bullet was design in the 70’s because pistol caliber rounds had a hard time penetrating car windshield (windows). The KTW bullet contain steel core instead of a lead core. The steel hard core is what made pistol caliber bullets defeat Soft body armor. Teflon was added to the bullet because it helped the bullet grip the windshield better (windshield are slanted) else there is a chance that the bullet will deflect (check out modern tanks because they use slanted armor for a reason) off the windshield. It is the steel core that makes the bullet defeat Soft body armor and not the Teflon.
Black_Knight
29-06-02, 01:11 AM
I think you take this to seriously…
Yes I do. Firearms are not toys. Use it like a toy and you blow your dick off and yes it has happen.
Black_Knight
29-06-02, 01:35 AM
Originally posted by Fred
Yes I do. Firearms are not toys. Use it like a toy and you blow your dick off and yes it has happen.
I am well aware of that.. I will not go into an argument of genitilias, but your points are vaild and I conced for now…
Shooting is also an international sport. One need to know everything about guns to complete ;) .
Black_Knight
29-06-02, 01:40 AM
Originally posted by Fred
Shooting is also an international sport. One need to know everything about guns to complete ;) .
I am aware of that too… But like I said, I live in a very anti-Gun territory in the States, and I can't get out…
Linna32
29-06-02, 04:03 AM
poor you, oh well I used to have a shotgun.... then we movced and i wasnt allowed to keep it anymore (i used old encyclopedias and bottles to shoot at)
Why is that? Where did you move to?
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