Will...

[Drizzten]

Is the destiny of mankind controlled by some transcendental entity or law? Is it like the hand of God hovering above? At least it is true that Man has no control, even over his own will.

What evidence in the series supports the famous opening monologue? I've seen the series twice all the way through and I could never pick out why they said this at the beginning.

[Petezilla]

Spoiler alert

Good question
I think this refers to the whole story actually the behelit is griffiths destiny actually its the band of the hawks destiny too whatever they did they could never run from griffiths dawnfall they were all destined to be sacrificed. This also refers to gatts who is just fighting against destiny everyone keeps telling him that sooner or later the brand will be his dawnfall too as anyone who is carries it is destined to die. I really hope he doesnt tho.
I hope this cleared things up a bit for you altough the things i've said are fairly obvious so you might have thought of this too.

[gaspacho soup]

Their are lots of references to 'fate' throughout the story. the question in the intro is probably in direct reference to that. 2 examples are:

"They're all dead, this was their fate.."

"it is the fate of all those who bear the mark of sacrifice.."

"you may have the power to stop fate..."
-skull knight, talking to Gatsu after the sacrifice.

But 'fate' doesn't always hold true according to the facts. Zodd prophesized that gatsu would die during the sacrifice in episode6, yet he was proven wrong.

http://uploads.nulani.net/uploads/09.jpg

Perhaps it's trying to say something about Gatsu being the only person who has a will of his own?

[Nagha's revenge]

I can do two things right now:

1. Sum up all of the things in Berserk that suggest the importants of fate and how mere mortal men can do nothing to change it, and yet how Gutts lives and explain how in fact he may already be dead.

or..

2. Ask you: What are you really getting at ? All the answers given are obvious, was there another reason for asking ? (Just wondering)

[dheu]

Originally posted by Drizzten
Is the destiny of mankind controlled by some transcendental entity or law? Is it like the hand of God hovering above? At least it is true that Man has no control, even over his own will.

What evidence in the series supports the famous opening monologue? I've seen the series twice all the way through and I could never pick out why they said this at the beginning.


Speaking as one who knows what happens in the end but has never seen the whole series, maybe the opening refers to...

SPOILERS





Griffith's destiny to become part of God Hand. Every circumstance in his life just increased his desire to have power: to rule, to have his own kingdom, etc. How much control did he even really have? It seems that he was just being pushed farther and farther with each event in his life, until the point where, when he has the chance to have the ultimate power (i.e. be part of God Hand), he snatches it up. Maybe the intro's just trying to imply that all these events that pushed him were caused by some ultra-superior being to cement his destiny.


dheu <-- shrugs...

[Drizzten]

I understand the connection to the Behelit and the deistic characters in the series. My point was that I never saw any evidence which showed most of the human cast was unable to control their will.

As gaspacho soup pointed out, Gatts regularly flaunts what he is supposed to do. The higher echelons of the Band of the Hawk don't seem to be unable to do things of their own will...now, granted they stick around the BotH for various personal reasons (one of them being Griffith's charisma and goal-oriented drive forward), but to the best of my knowledge they are never shown being forced into a choice they didn't want to make. This is the same for the other secondary characters, such as the two warring countries we get acquainted with during the bulk of the series.

I may be reading into the opening monologue too much, but it explicitly states that humans have no control over their will, which means someone or something else does. I don't see evidence for this assertion if you leave out the Behelit and it's affects, which only directly affected Griffith.

[Nagha's revenge]

Drizzten
Is the destiny of mankind controlled by some transcendental entity or law? Is it like the hand of God hovering above? At least it is true that Man has no control, even over his own will.


Now this is something I can answer.
It is in part destiny and a sence of doom, basically I think it's saying there's only one future and mankind cannot stray from it.
I don't think you'll be satisfied with that answer so I'll hook you up with something else. Mankind has no control over his own will up to the point that mankind thinks it wants what it wants. In reality it's being manipulated from above to think this and to make these choices.
Corkus is a good example. He once was a leader of a small gang of thieves and then Griffith came and cut his dream in half. So he decided if he couldn't have his dream he'd share in Griffith's. He could have done so many other thing but none were as attractive as the choice of joining Griffith.
In the beginning Gutts fought Griffith for his life. He lost against all odds. Was it really because Griffith was so much better or was it just ment to be ? Same goes for the final bout between the two. Gutts' sword should have sliced Griffith's sword the first time they fought like it did the last, this was all manipulating Griffith.
Also the little kid that wanted to be a knight. His death prepared Griffith for the consequences of following his dream through.
This also explains how Griffith was always right in whatever tactic, he was ment to be.
Mankind has no will because they are weak and can be are influenced too much by their surroundings (Wouldn't that be what a demon would say ?). Mankind does, however, have the illusion of will. The wonderful thing about Berserk is the manga, is Gutts really going against fate ? Or are his actions part of a grander design ? (No, I'm not going to spoil the manga ^_^ )
It's all destiny and doom, the masses being manipulated to accomodate the few.
The voice said so itself:

"Is the destiny of mankind controlled by some transcendental entity or law? Is it like the hand of God hovering above?... "
A puppet may think it's doing what it wants, but I guess it never sees it's strings.

[Drizzten]

Interesting, and thanks for that. :)

Does anyone else have an opinion?

[Petezilla]

the manga is much clearer it explains things better.
(Little spoilers ahead)
The easiest way to explain it is that everything is like the sea what Gatts does is simply putting rimpels in the sea he tries to be a fish by killing all the apostles but in the end it changes nothing griffith was meant to be a godhand and realize his dream and there is nothing the others could have done about it(I twisted the words of the skullknight a little).