Car Purchasing Questions

[daniel480]

Well, I've been searching around lately to find what car I should buy, and I was wondering if any of you I-D frequents have any opinions?

I've been looking for something that's reliable (yeah. . so the RX-7 is out of the question), with decent specs that might range around $30000 USD and lower (it can be used or new).

I've conversed with a friend and he mentioned the few Toyota cars (including the AE86 for good fun), the Lancer (not the EVOs), and the Jetta, as well as various Audi cars.

What are your opinions on these? And do you recommend any cars and why? Any experiences?

[fasad]

try a car owner/enthusiast (sp??) maillist or messageboard for broader and more knowledgable advice. believe actual owners rather than hearsay and hype.

anyway, know what you want out of car, what your $$ allows (not just purchase price) and availability. finding a gts (us) ae86 for sale is a hard task and a good chance to get ripped off.

[psycnarf]

Well I would say that the Lancer is a good choice (not the Evo). Toyota cars are also good, the corolla and camry are reliable. Nissan Sentra GTS, and Mazda 323 are ok.

[akaflakes]

Assuming that the highest price you want to spend is $30000 and you want a fun car Ill give you my opinion.

The price for a Lancer Evo is $28986 or something real close to that. Falls into your range. Very fun car. The only problem that I can think of is that this is the first evo that has been massed produced. It COULD have more quirks than previous evos but so far nobody has had any major problems with the new Evo 8. I frequent evolutionm.net alot so I know. no luxury here. Expect a somewhat harsh ride all the time

The rx-7 is as reliable as any other car. The only time you run into trouble is when you start to up the boost with out taking precautions. Just like with any other car.

the regular lancer is an ok car. Dont believe anything about the rally inspired suspension crap though. Its completly usa made with not much jdm influence. But the aftermarket for this car is growing so if you want to make it faster you can. interior is garbage though

I noticed that you didnt have any Nissan cars in your list. Its not hard to find a good used 240sx for cheap and there are tons of things that you can do with this car. The only thing to watch out for is mileage on the motor. If you ever buy an older 240sx make sure it has the ka24de motor, more aftermarket. Ka24e's(89-91 models) are known to eat itself when the guides pop off the timing chain. the chain goes though the head or something like that. Easily avoided if you know anything about cars though. Back to the mileage thing, if its old(100k+ miles) go ahead and replace the timing chain and head gasket.

Dont know much about Jetta's except that you will be wasting your time with anything else besides the 1.8t IMO

I would stay away from any mazda cars that dont have a rotary engine. That way your not buying a ford in disguise :)

Dodge is coming out with the new srt-4 or some weird name. Front wheel drive and stock turbo engine. Its built for speed but probably doesnt come with much luxury.

I myself would stick to the rwd platform cars. Front wheel drive just isnt any fun except for daily driving. Awd cars just have too many things that could break. that and they have more hp drivetrain loss.

Happy hunting

[ParticleEffect]

dodge srt-4 >20k (probably the best value you'll get for a fast car with a warrenty)

evo8 >30k if you find one the dealers aren't marking up (fast, 4wd, 4 door, warrenty)

as for used cars, you could probably land a mIV supra tt for under 30k, but its used and probably no warrenty, has small back seats.

I wouldn't recommend an rx7 unless you have a passion for it and another car for when it's broken. (no back seats, small car, enough room for 2 big guys and a little luggage but thats it, fast as hell, nimble, when its working)(i have a 93 rx7 btw) expect to pay ~16-18k for a very nice example, up to 20 for one that's well modded with probably a rebuilt motor.

Maybe a VW gti with the vr6 engine, but I don't know much about them. they are well made I hear, and you can buy them new for probably low 20's.

-I'd stay away from cheap ass cars like a base lancer IF you have upwards of 30k to spend and are a car person, the base lancer is and only is an econo-box.

:)

[daniel480]

Yeah, the thing is I'm still getting input.

I've heard numerous things about maintaining the RX-7 and such, and in the end, don't think it'll be a good investment for now. Not until I have a steady job and finished college, etc. Maybe then, depending on the cars out and so on, I'll experiment a bit more.

and Fasad, the only reason I'm considering an AE86 is because my dad's friend has one that he's willing to sell off. So in the end, that option is always viable if I can't find another car.

[Nokari]

Unless you love rotors or at least know how to maintain a rotary engine well, you shouldn't consider an RX-7.
I recently did some researching on what car I want to buy next, within the same price range as you desire.

A 2000+ Toyota Celica GT-S is a good buy. You get a reliable car with roughly 180hp for $12,000 to $19,000 (new)

A 2000+ Toyota MR-S is another good buy. Albeit it's relatively low hp (around 130 I believe), it has potentially great rewards with a turbo kit. $18,000 to $24,000.

A Honda Civic EX (any year). Arguably the most versitile AND best buy for your buck sport compact. With 160hp stock and the ability to upgrade every possible part of the engine and body (as well as swaping bigger and faster Honda/Acura engines) is well worth it. Yet the largest downside to this is that anybody can buy one and make their's better than your's. $3000-$8000('92-'95), $4000-14,000('96-'99), $15,000-$20,000('00+)

A Honda S2000. While it is a beautiful car with aggressive style and aggressive power (240hp), it's not as affordable as all the others. Sticker prices range from $19,000 to $30,000.

A Mitsubishi Eclipse 1995-1999 GST or GSX. While both models come with the same 2.0L turbocharged 180hp engine, the GSX is the harder one to find and that is rightly so, since the GSX models come with AWD, providing a better launch when drag racing and better handling around corners. '97-'99 models range from $7000 to $18,000. Why mention only the '95-'99 models? Because the new models' style sucks!

A Mazda 6 2003+. Along with cool styling and soon to be booming aftermarket products available, this car is a smart choice when it comes to performance, handling, style, and customizability. At a reasonable price with great features and power, $21,000-$27,000 sounds good.

A Mazda RX-8 (manual). This is the greatest buy you can get for a new car within this category. With a 250hp manual trany Wankel Rotary engine and the ability to carry extra passengers for an exhilarating ride is a dream come true. The base price for one of these beauties is $27,000, but with a sport package and a few other extras you're looking at up to $33,000.

A Nissan 240SX(S14) 1994-1998. This car potentials for any modifier. With the ability to drop in a real S14 Silvia's SR20DET turbocharged motor, this car can become a monster at a good price. Prices range from $6000 to $14,000.

A Nissan 300ZX 1990-1996. This car comes with several different models. There's the 2+2 models (T-top optional), the 2-seater models, and a Convertable model. Comes with either a 3.0 V6 non-turbo, turbo, or twin-turbo (230-300hp). You're best choice would be to go with a 95 model, due to several bad parts that were fixed in the 95 and 96 models, yet the 96 models suffered from Emissions laws which caused the Nissan to detune the engines a bit. $5000-$24,000.

If you're lucky, you might be able to find a Nissan 350Z for under $30,000. That's 280hp!

A good idea would be to find one of these cars that has already been modified because most modifiers keep their cars in good to excelent condition, and out of bad weather. Not to mention, you can sell the parts that you don't like or want to replace with stock parts for big bucks.

[Steathassasn]

i havent been around lately but ill make up for that ..

so..you want a car for under 30k (considering you havent bought anything yet)

a few cars the others left out..

BMW's - any model, unless there is serious a..rust and cosmetic problems id buy one. Most used ones are cheap. and BMW has a reputation for being fast and extremely nimble through corners

Subaru's - another car im sad to see that was not mentioned. for under 20k you get a A crash test rating, which is on par with Honda. not to mention AWD and enough room for you and your friends. whats that you say...theres no after market ? :insert evil laughter here: if you look hard enough you can find stage 4 turbo kits for 95 legacy's not to mention a few cosmetic options for the 95-04 imprezass. and alot more things i care not to mention ..:cough:watertoairintercooler:cough::

GM & Mopar - they make some pretty darn good domestic cars for the money and they have a strong aftermarket for most of their vehicals

Ford- aka mechanics specials....if your gona buy a ford ..please ..stick with the Mustangs since they seem pretty reliable as well as the Focus and probe (stick with the GT models..argh )...the others are well..a waste of money since there isnt much of an after market for the rest. (well excluding the Festiva..)

Audi- you touched on it but no one else did...personaly they are rather good cars. in one such instance a friend of my dad rolled one...he pushed it right side up ..punched the roof back into place and so far hasnt had any problems. They do have one draw back. Parts are rather expensive and hard to find. unless your getting a current Audi..i wouldnt mess with one unless your sure its in good condition

VW's- i dont like em for personal reasons but they are good reliable cars that can take lots of boost with out much of a problem.

Infinity & Lexus - they cost more. but you get luxury >.>. The toyota Soarer/ Lexus Sc300/400 and the GS300 are good RWD cars that come with leather as a standard option. not to mention they have a good aftermarket support....in japan. On Nissan's end you have the G20 and a few other cars..a yeah thats the only one I like but eh.

most important thing to rember is that no matter what car you buy. please ..for heavens sake take care of it. and change your oil every 3k

im done ranting...ciao

[akaflakes]

Originally posted by Nokari
Unless you love rotors or at least know how to maintain a rotary engine well, you shouldn't consider an RX-7.

A Mazda RX-8 (manual). This is the greatest buy you can get for a new car within this category. With a 250hp manual trany Wankel Rotary engine and the ability to carry extra passengers for an exhilarating ride is a dream come true. The base price for one of these beauties is $27,000, but with a sport package and a few other extras you're looking at up to $33,000.

So you dis the rx-7 cause it hs the rotary engine but praise the rx-8 cause it has the same thing. Clue me in on this one. You also forgot to mention that the rx-8 is sadly lacking in the area of tourqe.

Originally posted by Nokari
A Nissan 240SX(S14) 1994-1998. This car potentials for any modifier. With the ability to drop in a real S14 Silvia's SR20DET turbocharged motor, this car can become a monster at a good price. Prices range from $6000 to $14,000.[/B]

Why does nobody give the ka24de a chance?? Dyno charts have proven time after time that the ka makes more hp and way more tourqe at the same boost level as the sr. It's just a shame that no big tuning company will pick up the ka and make it something great. You just cant beat displacemnet. It about the same price to make a ka24det as it cost to get and install a sr20det.

Daniel you should post back and tell us what you think of our ideas. Maybe give some more info on what you like. example performance, luxory, family car, import, domestic etc.......

Steath. I agree about BMWs. great car. But you dont have to change your oil every 3k miles. thats just an old myth made by oil companies to make more money. Unless your really hard on your engine or boosting you can go a little longer. heck there are some synthetics out there that warranty their oil for more than 20k miles.

[daniel480]

Well, I'm looking for something that's reliable enough as so that I won't get frustrated enough to sell the thing off. Hopefully something with a little promise, which will allow some minor (if not heavy) mod options.

High performance, and mostly fun to drive around. But reliable enough to drive around to a few places daily and possibly 200-ish mile trips.

[akaflakes]

High performace and fun to drive right from the door. Im going to give you some more options and/or restate some.

Reliability wise you just cant beat Toyota. Yes they are even better than the all might Honda. I think that JDP did some research and found that Toyota vehicles were more relable than all other manufactuars in the US. Mitsu and Suburu were near the bottom of the list. Did you know that Honda threatened to sue a well known website because they listed some recalls and/or defects in Honda cars. The website ended up taking them off the page to avoid the lawsuit. I just cant remember what site it was at this time.

Celica. I think they make a awd model. I would pick that up. Dont know price right off hand though. Only bad thing is that they have a rather high compression motor I believe. Makes it rather hard for amatuer tuners to turbo the car. its either 10:5.1 or 11.1. One of those. Tourqe has got to be killer with that type of compression. Or HP.

Mustang svt. Im pretty sure you could pick up a new one for how much you want to spend. That way you have a power band that those pesky 4 bangers can only dream about right from the factory. And they are fun to drive. I used to drift one. Cheaper model not svt though. One great thing is that Ford(and chevy) is not scared to send out recalls or fix low hp problems in their vehicles. They want you to be happy with your car so you will continue to buy domestic vehicles.

240sx. I just keep stating this car because its going to be the next civic. Aftermarket keeps getting bigger for this car. Can swap in about 4 different engines into the engine bay without much difficulty. some people have even thrown in 350s and Lt1s. Tein makes a complete coilover suspension upgrade for it. 4 different companies (greddy, nsport, fmax/turbonetics, and real nissan)have made turbo kits for the ka if you want to keep that engine. Sadly there doesnt seem to be any affordabel pistons, rods, or quality turbo manifolds for the car. Expect that to change. Blitz made a killer full exhaust expecialy for this car. Not many imports get that from bitz, only the really good ones. Injen is just one of the few companies that made intakes for the car. act for clutches. Jimwolf for remapped ecu and other small upgrades. I could go on for days. If i was going to buy a different vehicle for performance it would be this one.


And right now is really the time to buy a new vehicle. You can basicly rape the saleman and everyone walks away happy. Not to mention most places are offering 0% apr for interest. Plus all the little discounts like factory rebatse, 1st car purchase, college grad(maybe not yet) Knock the price down even more. Just remember that you dont have to purchase a car from anyone. Never let a salesman pressure you into buying something you dont want. The longer a car sits on their lot the more they have to pay for it.

[Steathassasn]

oh yeah i just thought of a few other cars that are kind of interesting and are under 30 k

The Mitsu 3000gt vr-4 - very rare and heavy car but with the right parts it can become a awd monster

also The old 300zx twin turbo- also very rare but is available for about 17-8k. its a good car although you should have the trany looked at after purchase since most z's are pushed pretty hard.

another car thats frquently overlooked is the S12/200sx - before it was turned into a ff car it was on par with toyota's AE86, yet no one tunes the 86 wanabee..but for less than a grand..why not be the first ?

oh yeah good Point Akaflakes ...but still ive seen horrors of no one taking care of their vehical...i just want everyone who gets a car to read their manual and take care of it....heck even my manual says every 6k but i run it hard and its old so i change it sooner..

anyway..good luck..and happy hunting

[Nokari]

Originally posted by akaflakes
So you dis the rx-7 cause it hs the rotary engine but praise the rx-8 cause it has the same thing. Clue me in on this one. You also forgot to mention that the rx-8 is sadly lacking in the area of tourqe.

I love the RX-7. I don't "dis" the RX-7 simply cause it has a rotary engine, the point is that they have larger rotaries and require a lot of knowledgeability to maintain and upgrade, compared to the more compact/simplified Renesis rotary in the RX-8. My point is that daniel480 should know what he's getting into when buying an RX-7.

Torque isn't everything. Lot's of domestic car lovers take more of a look into improving torque than horsepower, which can lead to a big surprise when a Honda pulls away from their big torquey domestic. Of course, just because those torque figures of a stock RX-8 may be lacking, it doesn't mean it'll be stuck with low torque figures after adding more performance parts. Take a gander at the article in Car & Driver that compares every aspect between a Mustang Cobra, Infinity G35, and the RX-8. It may have not been the most powerful car in the bunch, but after intense testing, the RX-8 came in 1st place overall. Just remember that you can easily add a supercharger or turbocharger to produce big numbers.



Why does nobody give the ka24de a chance?? Dyno charts have proven time after time that the ka makes more hp and way more tourqe at the same boost level as the sr. It's just a shame that no big tuning company will pick up the ka and make it something great. You just cant beat displacemnet. It about the same price to make a ka24det as it cost to get and install a sr20det.

Where do you get that info from? I've never come across anything that supports the KA24 over the much desired SR20.

[akaflakes]

Originally posted by Nokari
I love the RX-7. I don't "dis" the RX-7 simply cause it has a rotary engine, the point is that they have larger rotaries and require a lot of knowledgeability to maintain and upgrade, compared to the more compact/simplified Renesis rotary in the RX-8. My point is that daniel480 should know what he's getting into when buying an RX-7.

Torque isn't everything. Lot's of domestic car lovers take more of a look into improving torque than horsepower, which can lead to a big surprise when a Honda pulls away from their big torquey domestic. Of course, just because those torque figures of a stock RX-8 may be lacking, it doesn't mean it'll be stuck with low torque figures after adding more performance parts. Take a gander at the article in Car & Driver that compares every aspect between a Mustang Cobra, Infinity G35, and the RX-8. It may have not been the most powerful car in the bunch, but after intense testing, the RX-8 came in 1st place overall. Just remember that you can easily add a supercharger or turbocharger to produce big numbers.

Your still going to run into the same problem with the rx-8 that people ran into with the rx-7. Why would a mechanic learn aobut a motor that he might never see. Rotory engine sales wont even amount to 1% of car sales in the US. Unless someone nears you specializes in the rotory engine you are going to have trouble getting someone to fix it besides a dealer. I agree that he should know what he would be getting into if he bought a rotory powered car. Not just the rx-7

Umm no. Its not easy to just add a supercharger or turbocharger. To be done properly you basicly have to mod just about everything on the car. No point of going faster if you cant stop or you suspension isnt capable of handling it. Fuel maps and sensors need to be tricked or modified. Better clutch. bigger exhuast. list goes on and on. Besides if the dom car goes FI then where is the advantage. None.

A HEAVILY MODDED Honda can pull away from a dom because of the redline limit of a motor. Same reason why f1 cars have 13000 rpm limits with 1000 hp with only 150 torque. numbers are not exact but the same principal is applied.

Oh btw if I could afford it I would buy a rx-8. Its way more boost friendly on paper than the rx-7. And car and driver is a joke. I wouldnt be surprised if they didnt even actually test the cars. The didnt even test the new Evo 8 before putting out its performance numbers.





Originally posted by Nokari Where do you get that info from? I've never come across anything that supports the KA24 over the much desired SR20. [/B]

240sx.org Look into the Kat section. find dyno charts. The sr is so desired because of the turbo friendly compression and the fact that its a jdm motor that will bolt it. not to mention that it already has a friggin turbo. But the Ka has more displacement. Meaning its needs a bigger turbo(within reason. maybe a t3/4). Bigger turbo means more power. More displacement means less lag. less lag = lots of fun. sr only beats the ka with its redline. So what if the ka needs forged pistons and rods to put out serious numbers(300+hp) The sr has to be resleeved around 400hp anyway. I like both engines but I feel IMO that the ka is a better motor.


Lets keep this discussion going. Anyone else want in??

[Steathassasn]

first off im glad to see that me, akaflakes, and particle man ( a..you know who im talkin about ) arnt the only "tuners" on this board. Its always a pleasure to find another who has the same gasoline running through their vains.

ahh..i would like to get into the whole engine debate but as was stated before, if the rest of your 'Crap" isnt up to par with the engine you might as well be running stock.

i would really like to get into this but this isnt my area of expertise. although if the Ka is as good as you say it is ..maybe i could squeaze one into a S12, the 86 copy cat. and only spend 10k mughaaa...

[ParticleEffect]

brakes, na, you don't need no stinkin' brakes, you just drifto to stop like when my yamyha blaster had no brakes back when i was young.

hehe, anyway, I'm actually thinking about a v8 swap for the FD. mm, ls1 with 350 hp.

anyways, on topic, I still think that;
new(under 30k);
dodge srt-4
evo8

used;
integra-r
mkIV supra tt -maybe
97-98 240 sx +turbo
300zx tt
IS300s(??) -sporty sedan thing, they look good and are probably alot cheaper to tune than a bmw or audi.
maybe an audi a4t quattro (awd) if you don't want to do much to it and still have a sport sedan.
IF you can get it used, an 03 mustang cobra (super charged straight line machine)

*shrug*
cars i don't mention because;
rx8 - the manual is more expensive (more powerfull engine too), but i don't know if the manual breaks the 30k mark.
wrx-sti -over 30k
rx7 -too small for an only car. you have to really not mind working on it yourself and I go through phases of motivation so right now i hate working on my car (i still haven't wired my boost guages light) = $$$ for work to be done.
3000gt-vr4 -heavy and slow, too rare for much aftermarket that i've noticed.
bmw 3s - aftermarket is too expesice (6-10k for a FI kit)
"86" - too damn old (and rare in the US) for an only car.
turbo mr2 (early 90's) -too damn small for an only car.

mustang and camaro(sp), most of their aftermarket is straight line stuff so unless you only like that, you might be at odds. but a 5.0 is a like the civic of US drag racing imo, there is a ---- load out for it.


--
anyways, yeh, I duno where the hell I want to go with my car in regaurds to engine right now. the allure of a v8 swap is much; reliablity unmatched in a turbo rotary, every decent american mechanic knows them inside and out. the issue of the day is my ---- bushings equalling about ~1200-1400 in replacement parts alone... for bushings... that's it, no money into coil overs, sway bars, nothing, just ------- bushings... lmao(cry). oh well, IM GOING TO SEE 2SLOW2DELERIOUS AND PIMP OUT THE FD TO ALL THE KIDDIES!!!

[Nokari]

Originally posted by ParticleEffect
mkIV supra tt -maybe


From what I've heard around, you can't get insurance for a Supra unless you've driven the past 2 yrs with a clean record (that means no tickets whatsoever). At least that's what I've heard, but I don't know if it has anything to do with age either... Speaking of insurance, good luck affording that on top of car payments, but hey, if you've got a good job...

You can get a Lancer 7 (the lower hp non-evo american market piece) for under $12,000 fairly new and drop in an Eclipse 4G63 Turbo engine.

[Nokari]

Daniel480, (according to what your last post said) I think the best choice, without having to spends tons of $$, would be with either a Civic EX(or SI), Integra GS-R, Celica GT or GT-S, 180sx or 240sx. Each of these cars have around 160hp+, are reliable, are good daily-drivers, and have huge aftermarket support. Plus, if you're a JDM lover, most of these cars have big markets for JDM parts/conversions as well.

[ParticleEffect]

nonono, lancer = crap, even with AN ENGINE SWAP. civic = most stolen car in america ;p. celica = crap, hehe.

But the supra is reliable enough, and it's a chick magnet. check with your insurance company and shop around.

[akaflakes]

Originally posted by Steathassasn
i would really like to get into this but this isnt my area of expertise. although if the Ka is as good as you say it is ..maybe i could squeaze one into a S12, the 86 copy cat. and only spend 10k mughaaa...

The Ka by itself isnt much. Its only when it transforms into the ka24et or ka24det that it begins to shine.

There is no drop in engine swap for the US lancer. There is nothing even close. To drop in the 4g63t you would have to basicly build a new drive train for the car. If you wanted to go awd that is. If your staying FF I would be very afraid of snapping axels everytime I launched. Besides that engine is just to addicted to boost. It would be cheaper and more reliable to just buy the dang evo. RRM and RMR and RPW all have reliable turbo set ups for the 4g94 engine that is in the Lancer. But like with the Ka, if you start turning up the boost or dont tune correctly you will be needing new pistons shortly

P. I also didnt mention the new STI because well Im afraid of sucking small animals in through the hood scoop:lol: Sorry to hear about the bushings. If I were you I would go ahead and get the swap done.

[zxzxzxzxzxzx]

Umm, have you considered going *GASP* classic??
Clearly you boys are all very clued in on what's around today, but sooo much money to spend. If I had 30 grand to spend, I would build something up from a shell. But that's just me, I like old school road rally puppies with style - think Fiat, Beemer, even the Datto.

[Steathassasn]

i love the classics...heck id take an old Roadrunner or Charger over any ricer any day. The funny thing is, is that you'll probly pay more for the moment than for the rest of the compenets ..and if you use the full 30k your guarenteed to have a car that spanks those civics, supras, and what ever else the east throws at you...

the down side is that you'll only get 15 miles to the gallon ....like me

[ParticleEffect]

meh, i get about 12 miles to the gallon now, lol. that's about average for an FD. well, now that i have boost problems i probably get 15.

the thing about most old cars is that they are in general heavy because of the metals used and have far outdated suspension and brake tech. you wont save any money by going the hot rod rout and unless you do some work you'll probably be getting out turned by stock civic hachbacks.

[zxzxzxzxzxzx]

yeah, but not all oldies are crap round a corner - I lot of the tech used in german and italian cars from the 70s and 80s is being used now by a lot of manufactures (or at least upgraded derivatives, you know what I mean). for 30k you could get a fairly nice old porche, but that wouldn't really be the best daily driver....

Meh, what can I say, I can't help but like classics. My plan is to build up an early 80's 3-series coupe with a 2.7 litre 6-series engine (already got the engine)

[Steathassasn]

classic cars are crap if you suddenly hit a corner..but they do drifts pretty well, considering most are easy to whip around considering their unstable suspenson geometry (if not updated ) and bad weight distribution. But you do get alot of attention on the street. Considering civics and acura's are a everyday sight ( atleast around here)

i also agree with the old german cars but they are expensive...

but here's another option....ever think about getting a kit car?

OT:

4wks from now my car will be back on the road and then ill start the precious tuning process but i was having a delima right now.

should i instal the roll cage and sacriffice the back seat or leave it out

or is there a way i can have my cake and eat it too ...holla back and tell me what you think

[ParticleEffect]

cage. more body stiffness, safety, and the back seats can't be all that big anyway.

[zxzxzxzxzxzx]

yeah, the difference in a car after a cage install if awesome. But i guess it depends on how much performance you want from a simple street car, cos like you said it is a bit of a nuisance.
Personally I'd go for the cage...

[Steathassasn]

thanks for the insight amigos..

yeah theres back seats there but in a camaro you might as well not have any...

but back on topic...

did anyone mention a Motorex R32 skyline ? you could get the others but..a R32 is cheaper..and you get the same amount of hp...besides...the look can always be changed with a aero kit ..

right ?

[akaflakes]

Good luck getting a skyline from Motorex for less than the stated price. They do have hidden fees ya know. Unless your talking about a non gtr model. but whats the point. IMO its useless to get a skyline if its not a gtr. Kinda like buying an Evolution with gta trim. And I like the look of a stock Skyline.

Why you getting a cage Steath? Are you really doing that many mods that warrant a cage? What ever tickles your pickle I guess.

About classic cars. My friend has a 68 or 69 camaro convertible. Coolest vehicle ever. especially since it just got back from the shop cause of some engine upgrades. Sometimes we go out and try to stop light race those pesky 4 bangers but for some reason they never want to race him. Maybe it because the exhuast is louder than their stereo systems. Now he is trying to source a 4 speed and a bigger rear and then his car will be ungodly.

back on topic

Found another car to talk about.

Ford escort zx2. first off, shut up. So what if its ff. So what if its only 12k. Its faster than most stock focus'. Mags only dis it because it has less hp than the focus. but guess what. It weighs less. only takes around $4000 to build a basicly bullet proof turboed engine(get used to me saying this. For the average Joe to make a NA engine FI it costs around this much). The only draw back that I can find is that no one is offering a lsd for the model. but I can live with that. The only reason that ford does not advertise this car is so that they do not lose focus sales. Do you remember the probe?? Why did ford get rid of it? Because it was taking away too many Mustang sales. Dont know why becuase probes suck. If you want a sleeper I would really recommend this car. Actually Im going to be test driving one within the next week. its time I got rid of my truck. gas mileage is killing me.

[zxzxzxzxzxzx]

Heck yeah. I have no idea which model you are talkin about, I'm guessing we don't get them in aus, but I'm an escort fan from way back...

[akaflakes]

I believe all newer escorts are called the zx2 from 98-03 here in the states. Just a slight name change to make it more sportier. But this was before the Focus became Ford's main sub compact . I bet you guys in OZ just get the escort without all the fancy zx2 symbols engraved into the rear bumper.

[zxzxzxzxzxzx]

nah man, we haven't been getting escorst for about 15 years or so, it's a shame... Ahh well, at least we get quality ---- like the hyundai excel....

[akaflakes]

hehehe. Atleast you guys get some true kick ass imports instead of the watered down crap they sell in the states.

[Steathassasn]

yeah love those aussie cars.. Ive heard they have some pretty scary subaru's over there. Not to mention a few note worthy escorts aka the little car ford gave up on..

and yeah akaflakes ive heard about modding a zx2...personaly i like the older GT models my self..i just cant get around that cute boxy styling ^.^

anyhoo...why would you say probes suck..i mean ..didnt you have one ? besides a GT V6 5spd is realitively cheap now adays. Not to mention a few performance mods that are available for it.

also another car no one tunes...you'll be shocked to hear this one..The Ford Festiva...i mean if koni makes coil overs for it then you know something has to be up with this car. So i looked around and well there are quite a few Festiva tuners

also one more thing before i go....Cars to be tuned in the future

Toyota Prius... Honda Insight

if you could somehow get around that darn electric assist and the large shock hazards these could be the next Crx's of the future....maybe >.>

im done ranting...caio

p.s.

im not doing extensive engine mods but ridgality and a place to mount the harnesses is why im basically getting it...and it looks cool..and makes the car/ tank alot safer....

ok ..now im done

[akaflakes]

yeah the older gt models are better if you want ready made mods for the escort. But I dont mind custom making mods for a car that doesnt have much aftermarket support. I can weld and their are 5 junkyards within 20 miles of my house. Yea for me.

as for probes sucking. Its just my personal experience with them and other people that I know that have owned them. Atx are really glass. your lucky if you get 80k out of them. Mtx are not much better. Weather stripping coming loose around windows. gear shifter getting stuck. Stock exhuast rusting completly through in so many places. power seat belt motors eating themselves. eventual lifter tick. auto antenea motor going up all the time. car is completly junk for spl. rain water getting into hatch. I cant think of any more off hand. Im sure that there are more.