The Sad Truth of .Hack//sign

[Kyrakasa]

Everyone playing the game is either Severly handicapped or a loser in real life...


hmm.... now what does that tell us?


~_~

:liplick:

[ACE2001]

That I'm handicapped, plus a loser with no life of course!! Yah!:rolleyes: :D Are you having trouble with the game or you just don't find it not to your liking? Me, I'm almost finished with Mutation. Ah, can't wait for the next one.

[Safer-Sephiroth]

Kyrakasa meant in the anime, the people playing in the world are either handicapped or losers IRL, lol

[ACE2001]

Oh, my badd!!!:) Well, in any case I think the people that are playing the world are probably lonely or just looking at some way to pass the time. That's from what I have gathered. They aren't computer geeks or anything, just people who feel somewhat isolated from the real world, so they use their time to play in the "WORLD."

[Nilrem]

most people who play MMORPG's do it to pass the time.

it's no worse than playing on your PS2, going out to a pub and getting plastered, or going to the cinema.

It's a matter of perspective, people who go out to the pub/club every night with their friends aren't usually considered "sad and lonely", and yet people who interact with their friends online are...and yet the chances are the people you interact with online will be a more varied lot than the ones you meet at the club*


I think hack//sign does concentrate on the escape side of things (people playing to escape reality), but then again, people do that every day with almost any form of entertainment** :)

It also makes the point that you never know quite who it is you're interacting with, the "guy" behind the Axeman might well be a young girl, famous author, teacher, police officer, politician, sports star.
Everyone in MMORPG's puts on a front to a degree.

One thing to remember though, is that the unhappier/less choices to get out in RL the more you will probably spend "escaping" through other means (such as playing games, reading books etc).


One of the biggest pulls of MMORPG's IMO is the fact that even if you can't get out of the house much you can still meet all kinds of people, and visit new places ;)

*i currently "hunt" with a group of people in UO including
Students (various ages), Teacher, Husband and wife (and their grown up children), soldier (Swedish armed forces - just got back from Basra) + any number of other occupations (and locations).

**it's the whole idea behind most entertainment, for a while you can forget about your daily worries (the difference between say a movie or books and a mmorpg is that you create the character and decided a large part of the entertainments story/path)

[Spike 558]

Perhaps everyone is a loser because the real world is cruel and an artificial reality is a welcome subsitute.

Personally, I get along with people here in cyberspce much better than I do in the real world....

[Spider66SIC]

Nobody likes me....

:(

Heh, yeah, I agree with you guys. "The World" is a place to just get away from the real world, and just, be the person that you want to be. - if that makes sence.

And yeah, a fun passtime. Like a PS2.

[Fatal Outlaw]

well...not really, i wouldnt classify them as losers or hanicapped. (btw, Krim, and Mimiru arent handicapped or losers IRL). with the exception of Sora, the rest of the cast (except those i mentioned, Sora, Mimiru and Krim) are abused and coping in The World...so yea, more like handicapped and abused...lol

[Mav]

Most major characters in any "serious" anime, whilst not necessarily "losers" per se, have fairly major problems with their lives, or during the course of the series have bad stuff happen to them; that's what makes them interesting characters, so it's not really surprising that the .hack//SIGN characters are somewhat "damaged". I'm sure that there are plenty of healthy, normal, well-adjusted people playing "The World", but it would be an awfully dull series if it focused on them...

[Kyrakasa]

I've played MMorphs...

The truth is that in each mmorph there are 3 types of players...

1. Kids/ Newbies... They play the game for a few weeks and get bored, and then turn on their playstations...

2. Hardcore players... They are financially set... plays 8-16 hours a day... Their lives revolve around "THE WORLD"

3. Everyone else... These people lose... their lives and loveone's suffer when they ruin their lives pursuing "The World" before they're Rich landlords... These people make aggreements with their wives about playing for 2-5 hours a day... Then they keep getting sucked in... Or They are college students... or They skip work... Or they stop actually doing anything except think of ways to catch up with those who play for 8-16 hours...

So that's the truth...

Unless you're a kid with no attention span or a Rich guy with nothing else to do, then don't play a MMorph...

MMorph= Everquest, Ultima Online, Starwars Galaxies, new Final Fantasy one coming out... etc...



~_~

:liplick:

[Timon]

Eh, I'd combine 2&3 and make the 3rd "Casual Players"

"Self Control Powers... ACTIVATE"

addictive personalities definitely should stay away from most MMOG's, though, seeing as how they're never ending and all that...

[ParticleEffect]

Originally posted by Kyrakasa

Unless you're a kid with no attention span or a Rich guy with nothing else to do, then don't play a MMorph...



~_~

:liplick:

i don't agree. and it's already been pointed out that most people who play them are rather normal.

[AchtungAffen]

What was Bear after all? A private dick, divorced or something?

[Mav]

He was a writer, wasn't he? I can't remember whether I heard that from the series or from somewhere else, though.

[FayeFayeV]

Old thread, I know...<<

But my God, Kyra....could you be a little MORE ignorant and jerkfaced?

I mean come on.....You sound just like those people who say "anyone who likes anime is a pimply faced geek who can't get a date"

By the way....Don't you like Anime? I gues it's safe to assume that you're a pimply faced geek who can't get a date, eh?


quiet...I'm bored

[Kyrakasa]

Lol... I'm glad that your favorite past time, while being bored is finding old threads so you can troll and call them ignorant and jerkfaced...?

I have nothing more to say to you...

******************************


"Unless you're a kid with no attention span or a Rich guy with nothing else to do, then don't play a MMorph..." -Kyrakasa-

Well that's not entirely true with the world... But that's what dot.hack tries to show...

I'm just saying that I agree with dot//hack that playing MMorphs can destroy your life...


P.s. Ok... you guys tell me how little I know about MMorphs... Yet don't put any backing into it... I can bring up threads where People's lives have been badly affected by MMorphs... (Mostly from Everquest)



~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

omg omg a chance to talk about MY mmorpg xp (experiance, HAHAHA)


YESSS!!! -I've been waiting for this. Everyone better read this because it's important!

-long.

Ok, late fall of '99, I -someone who doesn't even know about the existance of mmorpg's, or care about rpg's in general- wander into the open beta of Asheron's Call. I play very easily for about a week untill it ends so they can finish up the pre-ship fixes on their (developers) own. Game goes retail in November '99, but I'm busy shooting people in Rainbow 6- Rouge Spear. That goes on till early February '00, when I get bored and happen accross, what else than (omgomg) the game I beta tested, Asheron's Call.

Driving as fast as I could home from the mall with a friend. I get home and probably don't talk to my friend for hours who's just not getting my hysterical "omg, dude, you see. this game, it like, doesn't end! yeh! its crazy!" (see, i did not know anything about mmorpgs so it was all totally new to me)

well i start on a "recommended" server, a normal, non pvp-only server. since i have no idea what i'm doing. anyway, I play and learn a ---- load about the game and others like it, i learn the hidden calculation rules in the game, i know so many hidden dynamics and unbalances that i get so bored. i never level or do anything. im about to quit. but then i run into a friend who left the "carebear" server for the player killer server a while ago's brother, he hooks me up with the guy i used to know, blah blah, i reroll a newb on the PK server.

the PK server is a totally different game because everyone can fight anyone, and this isn't carebear EQ where combat is boring disconnected crap. omgomg it rules, i die, and die and die alot. a year passes, i've grown the hell up on this PK ----, i got a high level really extream template mage (mages pwn because of a LONG running exploit where you can "godmode" and break casting animations so you can cast ---- as you run, remember though, this isn't carebear EQ combat, this is FAST detailed ---- where you don't just select and attack and wait for the dice to roll. combat is a keyboard mashing, heart racing throw down), and other high level stuff. i've been hacking my .client file to remove client side checks (everyone did it!, lol really). i know teh l33t exploits that have been around forever. -that's why "AC" is famous as a exploit of the month game. a friend of mine playing a melee and me as my mage own the ---- out of people as we tag-team across the map. -the hayday, the great times.

annyways, so many of the beloved player killer dynamics get nurfed to make the leap from carebear to player killer easier get nurfed (patched out), player killer combat because alot more about gang-bang stand and fight ---- that alot of the hard core super level gods leave. my interest starts to fall as the game starts to get a ridiculas about of new carebear (non combat, ie, crafting and bs) dynamics and alot less of the down and dirty fighting is gone. somehow another year goes by like this, the game just isn't what it once was.

way to late in the game, i sell my account for 200$ (earlier in the day, accounts were selling for 10x that). this was last january. i'm out.



i've "played", or "seen how it sucks"; AO, AC2, DAOC, Shadowbane, and just now SWG to name a few, and nothing competes with what Asherson's Call once was.


there were times when i was very addicted because i was finished with high school and bored. i probably spend a year of days ingame over the 3 some years. mostly through the span of 1 calender year. -in AC. but i never "cared" too much, it was always just a fun game. but the vast majority of people were semi normal players, even if they did "care too much" when i RAPED THEM (HAHAHAHA)! and by semi normal i mean regular people.



anyways, i hope that provides some good insight into what i know from experiance about games like this.

:lol:

[Kyrakasa]

I'm glad you like Player vs. Player... Lol... But you call Everquest A "Carebear"

(mages pwn because of a LONG running exploit where you can "godmode" and break casting animations so you can cast ---- as you run, remember though, this isn't carebear EQ combat, this is FAST detailed ---- where you don't just select and attack and wait for the dice to roll. combat is a keyboard mashing, heart racing throw down), -particleeffect-

I played Sullon Zek... 3 team player Vs. Player Server... and the player killing isn't all that's there.

We actually form friends and relationships that don't focus around trying to cheat and hack your .client files.

It's Pointless a game to play in God Mode. You Removed the one weakness Magic Casters have and turned the game into a "godmode" 3d shooter.... That you have to stand still so that Melee/Weapon users can actually HIT YOU...


ParticleEffect, you didn't play a MMorpg... You played what was the equivalent of a 3d Shooter (ex. Unreal tournament) except you thought you played a MMorpg.

In other RPG's you aren't god... I'll useYou actually had to get into a guild and "Raid" for items so that you can't hack or buy. Raids are designed by the SonyEQ to be for around 18-36 people.

You are depended on by those 18 to 35 other people to be there to Raid... You had a job:

1. "Tank" take hits because you had more defense equipment and hp equipment and Regen. There are about 2-3 tanks when you were lucky...

2. "Healers" for tanks and any caster which was unlucky enough to get the "NPC" nonplayer Nasty Dragon or Monster's attention. (A NPC Dragon etc can kill a caster in seconds...)

3. Enchanters and Manafeeders and Aggroers... Accessory people that make the raid successful... They make the mobs slower and easier to hit... They give those who need mana(aka. pool of magic) to continue to heal or nuke (aka. Offensive magic spell). Aggroers get the Mobs attention so the casters don't die.

4. Nukes... Damage dealers... Wizards are masters since they have the most mana efficient spells. Needed for massive damage quickly so that a monster doesn't run away or heal.

Now I've summarized since each encounter with a boss mob is different you pull(get the mob out into an area where you can handle him better) and you may have to kill it quickly when it gets low on health or it may Completely heal itself or teleport away and heal.

But what I mean is that you need more than your dice rolling...

Particle effect, you are classified as a Newbie and I will consider you normal in that like millions of others you haven't played the MMorph and that you would get bored playing a morph. ( You said so yourself that all you were interested in was smashing others in godmode)

In order to get "godmode" in a morph you have to make commitments to friends to get better equipment...

Those commitments are what gets in the way of Real Life and Hack//sign shows alot of that...

p.s. I played PVP... I've played 2 characters simultaneously before and I've created guilds and many friends and enemies... My knowledge of PVP isn't too shabby either

~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

let me rephrase since it's fun to talk about something i haven't talked about in a while, expecially outside of friends i made in that game that i still have.

there was a social aspect, don't get me wrong, like when i talked about the days where i tagg-teamed with a good friend being the best days there were. it's just that in AC, guilds are such a hardwired part of the game that on such a competitive server they are all business. meeting friends is something that is up to you, you might be in a guild of thousands (and i was most of the time), but other than not fighting or crossing eachother, you only know a few people. --now, on the other servers it's different and more social, but no body "role plays" on the pvp server. and it's just as fun.

"godmoding" was not an on/off thing, it wasn't something you could crack. it was really hard to learn and made you harder to kill. not impossible, and not a god, but you were considered one if you figured out the methods early in the games life. it happend when you timed movements with spell casting perfectly, hence they "keyboard mashing" (which isn't mashing at all, but it is more like a FPS).

client hacking, well, that was hacking. but it didn't do much, which is why it was so wide spread as opposed to a few people doing it and getting banned. it was basically the next wave of "godmode" after the first attempt to stop "godmode". it made it so the game was exactly the same as before the "fix". only mages benifited, and it didn't help against a melee much because of something else called "sticky-melee", any "melee" you did attack gave your charactor a slight amount of stick to the target. if the guy you were hitting had alot more run skill than you it wouldnt help, but if a mage with the same run skill as you was godmoding, you'd still stick.

now, on an interesting note since you might think i was the "chase everyone to the ends of the earth to kill them" type, i actually hated when they put a block on teleporting yourself away from somewhere if you had been involved in p/k activity. which sucked because it made for some really boring fights with people who couldn't hold up against me, but couldn't get away and couldn't be trusted to just let live around me.

I am very much a "mmop(persistant)g" player, i just don't care about all the cliche cookie cutter classes, something that AC had none of. and i don't want to "thward holy or vile with my mightyness", i just wan't to play. which, by the way, is what most people want.

i tried EQ, it sucked, the combat was the most detached i'd ever played. you can call me whatever you want, i'll call you a carebear. but im still happy to talk with you about mmorpgs.

in AC, only the best could raid alone (before the player skill factor was more and more patched out), and being one of the best made you known and feared alone. i love the persistant aspect of mmorpgs, i just hate to roll play and be forced to group.

ok, so it WAS "twitch" combat to godmode, but it gave more of a feel of immersion and control than planting and clicking and sticking to your charactors predefined roles.

[DreamWalker]

Kyrakasa, every MMORPG I've played is constructed that way. Anyone played Anarchy Online ? Or Dark age of camelot ?

[ParticleEffect]

yes, see "AO, DaoC"... both suck for pvp. even though AO doesn't try and the cyberpunk thing is cool. DaoC just all around sucks. talk about a leveling wall.

[Kyrakasa]

I'm not sure what you are refering to Dream Walker... Not all MMorpg's are the same but I did say that MMorpgs are more than Unreal Tournament.

My words are bold


I'm sure you had friends Particleeffect... But the only server you played on was the "Unreal tournament" server

let me rephrase since it's fun to talk about something i haven't talked about in a while, expecially outside of friends i made in that game that i still have.
playing unreal you still have friends... and the real life friends you brought to the game will of course still be friends

there was a social aspect, don't get me wrong, like when i talked about the days where i tagg-teamed with a good friend being the best days there were.

Let me explain the difference... You duoed and ganged up on other people that were minding their own business... Not that it's bad, but a real pk could take out higher levels solo...

In SZ we had 80+ people guilds where we planned where to level and where to stage player killing raids of more than 2 people... Nothing quild related was with only 2 people... Having 2 people join you was immediate in a guild... You had tons of friends who would bend over backwards to help if you were pk'd... if you needed a group... needed to finish a quest etc...

it's just that in AC, guilds are such a hardwired part of the game that on such a competitive server they are all business. meeting friends is something that is up to you, you might be in a guild of thousands (and i was most of the time), but other than not fighting or crossing eachother, you only know a few people. --now, on the other servers it's different and more social, but no body "role plays" on the pvp server. and it's just as fun.

On Sullon Zek the teams are split into Good, Evil, and Neutral... We roleplayed and had the rules of conduct for our team... Most of all you had rules to follow from your guild... You were either on a Play nice ruleset and treated others like a "Good" would or you were evil or neutral... Although I knew many nice evils and neutrals...

"godmoding" was not an on/off thing, it wasn't something you could crack. it was really hard to learn and made you harder to kill. not impossible, and not a god, but you were considered one if you figured out the methods early in the games life. it happend when you timed movements with spell casting perfectly, hence they "keyboard mashing" (which isn't mashing at all, but it is more like a FPS).

You refer to combat on EQ as button smashing... that means that you did not make it past the first few levels of EQ... You wanted to play Unreal tournament and not A RPG... there is an art to combat on EQ...

for example, Bards twist up to 3 songs simultaneously... If you can do that you are a competant bard...

In combat, good melees learn to joust... And learn to stun and break casting for casters...

If you were a newbie and just "keyboard mashed" then we could tell pretty easy... Those of you probably left and joined Unreal tournament or Asherons call...

client hacking, well, that was hacking. but it didn't do much, which is why it was so wide spread as opposed to a few people doing it and getting banned. it was basically the next wave of "godmode" after the first attempt to stop "godmode". it made it so the game was exactly the same as before the "fix". only mages benifited, and it didn't help against a melee much because of something else called "sticky-melee", any "melee" you did attack gave your charactor a slight amount of stick to the target. if the guy you were hitting had alot more run skill than you it wouldnt help, but if a mage with the same run skill as you was godmoding, you'd still stick.

I don't care how you cheated... In everquest there's a cheat where you'd run another program to track where all the player characters are in the game... You could do this with another computer with linux... Knowing where everyone is an invaluable pk tool, but in my guild you were disbanded if you used it.

now, on an interesting note since you might think i was the "chase everyone to the ends of the earth to kill them" type, i actually hated when they put a block on teleporting yourself away from somewhere if you had been involved in p/k activity. which sucked because it made for some really boring fights with people who couldn't hold up against me, but couldn't get away and couldn't be trusted to just let live around me.

That's stupid... You should be able to run if you can... In EQ, the goal is to make sure an enemy is decapacitated... by rooting (stop all movement), mezzing (puts enemy in trance), or snaring (slows down opponent by certain percentage depending on spell)

also you could stun and interrupt casting spells for teleport.

I am very much a "mmop(persistant)g" player, i just don't care about all the cliche cookie cutter classes, something that AC had none of. and i don't want to "thward holy or vile with my mightyness", i just wan't to play. which, by the way, is what most people want.
You wanted to play Half life or something
i tried EQ, it sucked, the combat was the most detached i'd ever played. you can call me whatever you want, i'll call you a carebear. but im still happy to talk with you about mmorpgs.
No you can't godmode in EQ... Thus you are a "carebear"...

you had to learn how to fight... Each class has skills that help you fight... you had to earn them and learn them...
in AC, only the best could raid alone (before the player skill factor was more and more patched out), and being one of the best made you known and feared alone. i love the persistant aspect of mmorpgs, i just hate to roll play and be forced to group.

You hate to role play and group with others? You aren't playing a "RPG" aka... role playing game...

You are playing Unreal tournament

ok, so it WAS "twitch" combat to godmode, but it gave more of a feel of immersion and control than planting and clicking and sticking to your charactors predefined roles.

You have no define roles in Eq... You could be a Cleric and player kill well if you wanted... Most of the times you'd had to run and heal yourself... But a cleric can win PK battles through attrition of Hitpoints... A cleric spends so little mana to heal... while the other classes can't heal as fast or efficiently...


p.s. My point is that you weren't playing an RPG... you played a 3d shooter.


~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

ok, now you done did it by not reading most of what I said.

"I'm sure you had friends Particleeffect... But the only server you played on was the "Unreal tournament" server"

RIGHT off where I talk about my first ingame time, I said I started on a normal server and played it for a year, so I know what it's like on both sides of the fence. jesus, some carebears. :rolleyes:

"Let me explain the difference... You duoed and ganged up on other people that were minding their own business... Not that it's bad, but a real pk could take out higher levels solo..."

god what do you even read anything past what you want to? HE was a melee, I was a mage, we teamworked and killed higher level people through fast coordinated teamwork. We killed everyone though, because we were in a state of perpetual war on the server. Now before you say how uncivilized we were for waring the server, some people like to actually compete for things and not all get along and hang out and ally everyone. Other wise there is no challange other than questing <- the point of pvp.

having a friend bail you out does not make you a pk girly, standing on your own makes you a pk. i guess again, im crazy because i can raid alone and take out multiple people my level isntead of form a ------- ZERG RUSH.

and oh, i've heard about this "joust" bs, where you start an ATTACK CYCLE and then run back and forth timing the auto cycling attacks. :rolleyes:

"That's stupid... You should be able to run if you can... In EQ, the goal is to make sure an enemy is decapacitated... by rooting (stop all movement), mezzing (puts enemy in trance), or snaring (slows down opponent by certain percentage depending on spell)

also you could stun and interrupt casting spells for teleport."

"stunning" and "mezzing" another person so they stand still so your ZERG SQUAD can kill them is NOT my idea of fun. once again, i guess AC is a FPS fest because you can't make an enemy stand still so you can ------- kill them with your zerg squad. :rolleyes:

"You hate to role play and group with others? You aren't playing a "RPG" aka... role playing game..."

I am very much a "mmop(persistant)g" player... I never said I was a role player, i said numerous times that i wasn't. I played "mmorpgs", but i would never call myself a roll player.


..."p.s. My point is that you weren't playing an RPG... you played a 3d shooter"

do you want me to post screen shots because this mentality is why you get called a carebear, you think that because everyone isn't role playing and that if people focus on fast connected combat, then it CAN'T be anything but a 3d shooter.

no level cap, quests, monsters, crafting, skills, attributes, guilds, and alot of carebears... it's a mmorpg. i, and alot of other people just omitted role play. so what makes it not as great as the all mighty EvarQueer?

please enlighten me as to why, because it doesn't conform to your boring dungeons and dragons ideals, it isn't an mmorpg? :rolleyes:

sheesh, carebears defending roleplaying.

[Kyrakasa]

no level cap, quests, monsters, crafting, skills, attributes, guilds, and alot of carebears... it's a mmorpg. i, and alot of other people just omitted role play. so what makes it not as great as the all mighty EvarQueer? -Particleeffect-

When ever someone leaves everquest, we mourn the lose of a good friend in the game, but we also wish them luck in real life since everyone who's been there knows how much a time sink EQ can be...

The time sink is from the role playing aspect...

If you just want to as you say...

it's a mmorpg. i, and alot of other people just omitted role play. so what makes it not as great as the all mighty EvarQueer? -Particleeffect-

What is Wrong with Omitting ROLE PLAYING in a MMORPG? Hmmm.... I wonder...

/sarcasm off

Like I said, All you wanted to do is play Unreal Tournament with God Mode...

My friends would say..."You sir, are a Newb..."

sheesh, carebears defending roleplaying.-ParticleEffect-

You should Try sullon Zek... before you call me or anyone a Carebear...

And about Roleplaying?

ANTA BAKA... Have you seen HackSign? Do they go around "God moding?" and killing each other?

I'm sorry but the entire series is composed of Several Friends talking and conversing....



~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

Originally posted by Kyrakasa

What is Wrong with Omitting ROLE PLAYING in a MMORPG? Hmmm.... I wonder...

/sarcasm off

that is a stupid question if you pull your head out of your ass and understand that pretty much all the big persistant online games are "rpg's" in style. and only about 1/10 of people playing these million dollar games "role play". you know this right? most people just play the game as it is, they don't talk like retards and take it seriously. what don't you get?

Like I said, All you wanted to do is play Unreal Tournament with God Mode...

My friends would say..."You sir, are a Newb..."

i'd say your friend is a retard, along with you. since you keep rehashing this totally inane point. i don't want to play UT with "godmode", or i ------- would. again, what don't you get about that? i want a persistant game with levels and skills. seriously, you're ignorange to most of what i say isn't getting you anywere.

it's like your just sitting covering your ears and humming, which says more about you than me.

You should Try sullon Zek... before you call me or anyone a Carebear...

just listening to your idiocy here makes me think carebear. you see, you hold the mighty mmorpg holy and anyone who cares about pvp more than role playing "just wants to play UT". it's a totally ignorant comment. ignorant of any pvp other than the little root-and-shoot you know from playing with your carebear squad.

And about Roleplaying?

ANTA BAKA... Have you seen HackSign? Do they go around "God moding?" and killing each other?

I'm sorry but the entire series is composed of Several Friends talking and conversing....




it's also gay. unrealistic crap about people being magically stuck in a game, about magical hidden aspects of the game, a bunch of losers who quest against the GAME (big challange there, woo). the only reason i watched it was for the novelty.


:rolleyes:

what's your next argument going to be? that i only want to play UT with godmode? thought so, carebear.

i think that your real problem is that you are, or were one of the losers you point out in .hack. your in some way threatened by people who play outside the game rules that you live by. if something doesnt fit into your status quo of role playing goodness, it is alien and bad. which is pathetic.

like ive said already, but you didn't hear, i've been on both sides, i played on a normal server for a year, it was fun for a while, then i left it behind for something more competitive, which you just will not understand. what i dont understand now, after switching to the pvp side, is how anyone could remain contept without challange outside of AI controlled monsters and the occasional root-and-shoot zerg squad.

[Tsu san]

It's true, one's life can be ruined by playing MMORPGs (see how i wrote 'playing MMORPGs' and not just 'MMORPGs'?); heck, i've heard a while ago a three-year old died in a car, while his mother was playing EQ O.o
The chances of that happening, however, are as big as a big slab of cheese falling out of a plane, on your back (breaking it), making your body paralysed for the rest of your life. Only difference with MMORPGs is that you actually have control over that, so if anything goes wrong, it's your own fault (kind of like drinking 300 cups of coffee and then dying; that's your own fault too)
Anyhoo, back to the subject; i personally don't think that the whole .hack thing is one big campaign warning people of the dangers of MMORPGs, they just needed a bunch of interesting characters (what would NGE be with just a bunch of normal 14-year olds?). Were I the main character of .hack//SIGN, you'd just be watching some guy chopping monsters, until he levels up and afterwards, he chops some more (kind of like Progress Quest: The Animation). Not something that'd sell, eh?

[Kyrakasa]

i personally don't think that the whole .hack thing is one big campaign warning people of the dangers of MMORPGs, they just needed a bunch of interesting characters (what would NGE be with just a bunch of normal 14-year olds?). Were I the main character of .hack//SIGN, you'd just be watching some guy chopping monsters, until he levels up and afterwards, he chops some more (kind of like Progress Quest: The Animation). Not something that'd sell, eh?-Tsusan-

i personally don't think that the whole .hack thing is one big campaign warning people of the dangers of MMORPGs, they just needed a bunch of interesting characters (what would NGE be with just a bunch of normal 14-year olds?).

If you use Evangelion as an example well Anno said himself that Eva has a message... I can also find a quote from the co-director of Eva but I'm too lazy :p
Anno had a message to send...



I tried to include everything of myself in Neon Genesis Evangelion... Myself, a broken man who could do nothing for four years.

A man who ran away for four years, one who was simply not dead...

Then a thought, “ You can’t run away,” came to me, and I restarted this production.


It is a production where my only thought was to burn my feelings into film.

~Hideaki Anno, source: Neon Genesis Evangelion, Viz Manga~

shinji and many of the characters from Eva are Anno's perception of himself.


Were I the main character of .hack//SIGN, you'd just be watching some guy chopping monsters, until he levels up and afterwards, he chops some more (kind of like Progress Quest: The Animation). Not something that'd sell, eh?-

There's 2 points for me to point out...

A Roleplaying game does not show people chopping wood... That roleplaying aspect is famous in Ultima online as being incredibly "dumb" if I can say nicely... :p

Second, I'm sorry to disagree, but any medium of entertainment from books, drama, to movies all are successful because they send a message.

I want you to brainstorm some Examples... "Movies about Change" "Books about Love and War" They all focus on the deeper meanings of the objects and not about the superficial aspects...

In Hack//sign there are messages that speak with us...

Hack//sign is not a mere Cartoon to get us all excited ... Oooh... Look at the colors...

it's also gay. unrealistic crap about people being magically stuck in a game, about magical hidden aspects of the game, a bunch of losers who quest against the GAME (big challange there, woo). the only reason i watched it was for the novelty.-Particle Effect-

If it's only because of the pretty colors and magical hidden aspects then this should only be watched by folks like Particle effect...


Basically ParticleEffect has Stated his opinions above that he thinks Roleplaying is "Gay"

And that itself proves that he isn't qualified to comment on Hack//sign.

p.s. WOOT!!! If you ROLEPLAY... YOU ARE A CareBEAR... I'm so glad... CareBears Care~!


~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

Carebear doesn't mean role player, it means an idiot who thinks that roleplaying your character is the only way to play a game. You could say that I roleplayed an evil person that almost never talked ingame if you wanted, never gloated, never ---- talked. I just didn't take it seriously and "get into character" when I played.

Role playing isn't gay, it's just the people who think it's the only way to do, like you.

"If it's only because of the pretty colors and magical hidden aspects then this should only be watched by folks like Particle effect"

Righto, you just keep looking for your deep meaning, you'll find it everywhere you look, but that doesn't mean it's really meant to be there.

Anyway, right, i have no idea what i'm talking about because i don't run around in my back yard dressed up like a retard with a bunch of people, screaming "LIGHTNIG BOLT" as i throw sticks at my friend playing an evil troll. :rolleyes: whatever you have to convince yourself so that you can't be wrong.

[Tsu san]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Kyrakasa
If you use Evangelion as an example well Anno said himself that Eva has a message... I can also find a quote from the co-director of Eva but I'm too lazy :p
Anno had a message to send...

shinji and many of the characters from Eva are Anno's perception of himself.


So he puts parts of himself in the characters? that's normal; i think pretty much everyone who writes a story puts a part of him/her in the characters. But that isn't sending a message.
Ever seenthe cartoon-series Captain Planet? That's sending a message, namely that you must care for your evironment etc. etc.

Anyway, in most MMORPGs i played, most people aren't actually 'roleplaying', just chopping monster for EXP (something that's strangely quite enjoyable), doing quests and talking to other players in the game, but usually not in a 'role' (eg. even though you have the class 'Knight' and thus it's abilities, you usually don't start acting like a knight, except when battling monsters and doing quests)

[Kyrakasa]

I'm not defending roleplaying that people have to be knights or say...

"M'lady may I...."

I don't mind the roleplaying in that adds depth that "Unreal Tournament doesn't... but if a ROLEPLAYING game thinks Roleplaying is "Gay", then I'm really confused.


Also if you watch hack//sign again... You'll see that I don't think Tsukasa, Subaru, Bear, Etc... None took roleplaying as you describe "Knight-like"...

Subaru took the role of GM... Which isn't roleplaying exactly as a knight... She simply found it a place that was more real to her than her cripple real world life.


But I'm not saying you have to "be" a knight to have RPG's become more real than life...

And That's what Hack//sign touches on... It touches on the thin line that separates reality and what's a game... When you're stuck in game, What exactly is more real?




QUOTE of THE DAY: HACK//SIGN is:
it's also gay. unrealistic crap about people being magically stuck in a game, about magical hidden aspects of the game, a bunch of losers who quest against the GAME (big challange there, woo). the only reason i watched it was for the novelty.-Particle Effect-
~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

Originally posted by Kyrakasa
And That's what Hack//sign touches on... It touches on the thin line that separates reality and what's a game... When you're stuck in game, What exactly is more real?

:lol: really, you are a retard.

do i have to make that the "quote of the day"? no. but i'm flattered that you thought so much of my genious to rule out the possibility of making any other quotes your quote of the day. a prestigous honor no doubt. ;)

[Tsu san]

hm...we might have different views on what roleplaying is; for example, if someone's role playing a White Mage and gave him/her a certain personality (what you do when making a character for role-playing), I'd think the person has to act according to that personality. That's something different than being labled White Mage, looking like a White Mage, having the abilities and stats of a White Mage, yet acting like yourself in random MMORPG #47
But I don't think 'GM' would count as a role, but rather a job; Subaru isn't playing as a GM, she /is/ a GM. she acts like a GM in the game because she is one

[Kyrakasa]

We do have different definitions, but my definition seems to be more general and prevalent in the games I played and in Hack//sign.

My definition of Roleplaying is exactly how it sounds... You take up a role and play it... All it has to do is differ slightly from who you are in real life... You don't have to play a role that's "gay" but if you don't want to, you don't have to change your personality.

In hack//sign no one changes their personality into a "white mage" or "knight"... You keep your personality but take up a different role in the society... of the game "World"

Subaru takes on the role of "Order" and through her care and love becomes a symbol that some admire (crimsom knights) and others hate (the players...) who always blame GM's for things they really can't help with.

Most GM's in games aren't paid alot... So, they are in fact playing... And serving a role... GM's have become so much a ROLE in RPG's that a RPG without GM's, wouldn't be considered an RPG by most experienced Players. So indeed GM's are playing a role and perhaps the most critical "Role" in a RPG...

You are absolutely right ParticleEffect, I'm so impressed that you've been awarded the Quote of the Week~!


QUOTE of THE WEEK: HACK//SIGN is:
it's also gay. unrealistic crap about people being magically stuck in a game, about magical hidden aspects of the game, a bunch of losers who quest against the GAME (big challange there, woo). the only reason i watched it was for the novelty.-Particle Effect-
~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

---- yes, how about quote of the year though, i'll cyber you for it!

hah, hell, there's some "role playing" for ya!

*I put on my robe and wizard hat*
*I cast cock of the infinite on myself and medidate to regain my mana*

are you ready for some real role playing? ;)

[Kyrakasa]

:lol:
If you have to meditate, you probably don't have enough mana

~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

oh, i have enough mana alright, i just want to charge my reserves before we get to it.


*particleeffect has cast "ghb" on you, you become tired and your resistance falls*
*particleeffect has cast "greater horny babe" on you, you become horny and long for his staff*

see, i can role play, oh yeah.

[Kyrakasa]

Now you've done it, I'll teach you to watch what you say...

Have you ever wondered why I'm carrying this scepter?

::Kyrakasa sticks the scepter up ParticleEffect's... (where it hurts)::



~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

*particleeffect likes the pain as he works the scepter like a cowgirl*

[ParticleEffect]

*particleeffect casts greater nakedness, it is an area of effect spell and we become naked*

[Kyrakasa]

*particleeffect likes the pain as he works the scepter like a cowgirl*-particleeffect-

OMg... My intelligence just dropped 2 points, from listening to you... :rolleyes:


~_~

:rolleyes:

[ParticleEffect]

when you play with fire, you get, cybered by a pervert.

you know you like it, you just don't know if it's right. well i say, go with what feels good baby. it's ok, i'll be gentle.

[Kyrakasa]

*particleeffect likes the pain as he works the scepter like a cowgirl*-particleeffect-

I'm sorry but you're confused... The only one pwned is yourself...

kk...


~_~

:liplick:

[ParticleEffect]

what are you talkin' about baby? i'm not "pwned", i'm just a dirty, dirty boy.

you know you like it.