anyone think the ending was just blah?

[tekblade]

i saw escaflowne so many times and the plot is okay and character development too, but wasnt the ending just plain old sucked? i mean you just saved gaea from destruction and all she does is go home? what is that? at the end it does show van sitting on a rock so is that supposed to mean that she can visit him any time? well its just me but i liked the series alot but the ending was just not right to me. :D

[Nairohe]

i guess he just didn't know how to end it... but if you think about the whole story and where it was leading to... this was the best plot possible...

see, in the first place, hitomi thought and considered gaea a dream... so no matter how things may seem real, her world, earth is her reality so she has to return to it and chose to return to it...

making hitomi stay in gaea wouldn't be good because its going to show how unreal she is... that means living in a dream world... for her at least... i dunno if i'm saying this right... eheheh... but i hope you get the idea...

i know the ending sucks because some of the relationships weren't cleared up or mended. Allen and Millerna for example... you dont know if they're still going out together or if they've let go of each other... and what about Allen's sister? what's with her? so now that she's back, what happens next?

There's Van and the cat girl... i doubt they'll end up together... its likely that van ends up the king of fanelia... but what?

[warlock]

Yeah, Escaflowne has one of the best story but the ending is quite disappointing. Most of the times when I watch the show it really excites me and all but the ending is a little bit cold and boring. I totally hate open endings cause it gives me headaches thinking on what's a better ending.

[EVA fiend]

I agree! The ending was kinda lame. I bought the VHS box set before I'd read any reviews about it (my credit card went ouch!!), and I watched the entire series in 3 days as the plot & the love triangle between Hitomi, Van & Allen really gripped me. When the final episode finished, I sorta said "oh". I was quite disappointed with the ending. Don't get me wrong, I really like the series, so-much so, that I'm starting to buy it on DVD, but the ending was a little bit anti-climatic...,

[tekblade]

ah i agree with you all, but iguess the creator had a tuff plan to create an ending to fit so i guess thats all he could come up with. i think he/she planned it ahead just did it while it was going i guess. im not assuming but im just guessing. :heh:

[random1377]

I think it should have ended with Van becoming dispondant and deciding that everyone should die, then taking his Ev- er, I mean melf, into the atmosphere to complete the third imp- um, I mean, ultimate fortune zone. Then Merle should have merged with Lillith and..... wait.... never mind....

Yes, I thought the ending was a little lackluster. Kind of empty. Didn't have the emotional impact that the rest of the series was builing up to. One thing I did like was that Dilandu was actually.... well, let's not spoil it for those who haven't seen it, eh? ;)

[kaia]

well, the ending kinda disappointed me. it wasnt what i expected. it was kinda hanging or something, but all in all, the anime is cool. :B:

[tekblade]

heh dont get mixed up with eva there :lol:

[random1377]

(holding head) so confusing!!! Melfs.... EVAs.... Impacts... Fortune zones.... Cat girls.... Clone girls.... Angels... Dragons.... MAKE THE VOICES STOP!!!!!

:)

[Manathern]

Just like the tv ending for Eva...

[tekblade]

well i dont know..

[Melusine]

I was disappointed with the ending (because the romantic in me always wants the characters to stay together) but at the same time I really respected it and I don't know how it could have been much better. I mean, it's a real risk to have an ending where the couple doesn't end up together. It would have seemed kind of corny if they have, even if it would have been more emotionally gratifying. I think you're just supposed to understand that Hitomi did what she needed to do, and grew because of it, but she needed to move on.

That's my take, anyway.

(SPOILER!)

I will say, though, I was really pissed off that she and Van never kissed. That would have made it all better. ;)

later

mlc

[kaia]

i was more surprised when i found i out that dilandu was actually allen's long lost sister.....

the ending seems to imply that everything was just a dream for hitomi. anyhow, its still good. :)

[Westlo]

Originally posted by random1377
I think it should have ended with Van becoming dispondant and deciding that everyone should die, then taking his Ev- er, I mean melf, into the atmosphere to complete the third imp- um, I mean, ultimate fortune zone. Then Merle should have merged with Lillith and..... wait.... never mind....



Escaflowne was released in japan the same time as Eva was so its a bit hard to rip it off

[Human Fighter]

Well I like Shoujo but I'm not a big romantic so the ending was good by my standards. It was somewhat realistic anyways. its not like they could stay together for every or anything.

[Westlo]

while the ending may have been disappointed will you be saying the same thing if say in the second series hitomi returns to gaea and blah blah.

I think it was pretty much the best they could do much better than the eva tv ending (at least it was all animated not still shots). The fight in the last ep was one of the best in the whole series.

I just hope they do a second series like ten years down the track after the first one so it still features van, hitomi etc

[Kayay]

I've seen worse, more ambiguous endings, and such open endings aren't uncommon in Anime. Although I too would have like to see Van and Hitomi actually kiss...
Its interesting that a pager message can span the gap between two worlds, but love can't even keep two people together.
I can only hope that the ending was left open to allow for a possible sequel.

Side question:
So, were Van and Hitomi able to keep the "connection" between the two of them at the end? That's how i interpreted that scene where she sees the image of him on the rock.

[tekblade]

i guess they can still communicate to eachother spiritually or something :D

[Teddy]

Are you kidding?? The ending seemed boring but it left thousands of possibilities open doing so!!!!!

[KetaSama]

One of the reason I :love: love Esca so much is because of the ending. Just like Teddy said, “it leaves so many options open”. But I guess I’m bias to this subject cause I’m a Escaflowne fiction writer and the ending was why I started to write about Esca. But in truth the ending as you stated wasn’t “blah” . Did it not force you to feel an emotion? That emotion may have been anger towards Hitomi goin’ home but still it was an emotion! Also, i have a question for all ya' readin this: Would you have like esca so much if the ending had been a "happly ever after" ending?? Anyhow.... I do agree with the orginal poster on one account, the ending sucked! But only because it was an ending. ::sighs:: but as we know, All good thing come to an end…:p

[Callisto]

heehee, I remember when I first saw a bunch of Esca epies. I wasn't really into the series, and only saw the last few episodes. I didn't even realize that Dilly had turned into Celena. I thought he had died or something, and that she was some sort of soldier, who had been gone a long time, and that this was the first time she was seeing her brother in years. But now I know better (unfortunately)

[waterfireGirl]

why didn't they kiss?

[tekblade]

i dunno, maybe they are gunna save it for later when they meet again :heh:

[VanandTrunksGal]

I think Van and Hitomi make the perfect couple, why does Esca have such a crappy ending!!! STUPID BANDAI!

[Sheex, The Dark Stalker]

sigh... Bandai didn't make Escaflowne, they're merely the company thats licensed to release it on video/dvd.

[IcedHildaChan]

I like the ending. It shows how well the creators envisioned it. If in fact, Hitomi had stayed on Gaea, she would've missed her friends and family within days. (Almost gives you an idea for a fanfic...;) ) So, she made a mature decision considering her age during that time. Me? I would've stayed with Van-sama and forgotten my Earth life. :)

[Eternity]

yah, me too. :D

[strawberrygurl]

it sucked soooooOOOOooo much. :sulkoff: it didn't really tell you what happened to everyone else. :mad:

it had this awesome story line and characters and then the ending is dumb.

but i think that it leaves it open for a seqaul....:D i REALLY hope so.

ya, why didn't van and hitomi kiss:kiss: ?? that was dumb.

[Sheex, The Dark Stalker]

it didn't really tell you what happened to everyone else. :mad: [/B]

Did you even watch the last few episodes? They told you what happened with virtually everyone.

Folken - dead
Dornkirk - dead
Dilandau - turned into Serena
Allen - reunited with his sister
Dryden - broke up with Millerna, went back to his ship
Millerna - went to be with her sister
Chid - back at Freid
Merle - helping rebuild Fanelia.

There, thats most everyone :P Try watching the series from the beginning again and maybe you'll notice exactly why Hitomi went back to Gaea. As much as every single Escaflowne fan on the face of the planet likes to overplay the Hitomi - Van love relationship, you have to remember they were a couple for about 2 episodes -_- it still would have been nice to see a kiss, but its not the end of the world that they didn't.

[Dilandau Addict]

Bwaaaaaaaaa!!!! Don't remind me that they didn't kiss!!!:bawling:

Just to throw in my two cents here, I personally had no problem with the ending, although all of your points are valid. (I was captivated with all the shinanigans and goings on) It's a shame the series wasn't 39 eps long like originally intended, otherwise many more fans could've been pleased.

It was a rational decision for Hitomi to make, going back to Earth and all. Considering that she's lived all of her life there (well, except for those few months) and that she's mainly accustomed to the values and policies there, it would've been hard for her to adapt to Gaean ways (note how many times an animal person freaked her out). That and she has friends and family living on earth, and while it'd be nice to bring themalong for a ride to Gaea, that obviously is out of the question. And I didn't really think Van and Hitomi's sudden relationship was premature. Considering clues from the whole series, Van has had feelings for Hitomi for quite some time. Just to name a few instances, when he stares open mouthed at Hitomi in her new dress, whenever he repeats his promise to get her back to earth, when he starts up Hitomi's heart again after her bizarre episode with the Doppleganger, when he boldy defends her from Dilandau some minutes later, and so on and so forth. And Hitomi has also had feelings for Van for a while, with the all too well-known uneasiness in her heart over Van and Allen. Actually she only felt attracted to Allen because of his dashing demeanor and his striking resemblence to Amano(damn that Folken and his Fate altering! Grr!). So when Hitomi and Van finally openly confess their feelings for each other, I felt it perfectly rational, though others here may debate as much as they want about it.

The ending was displeasing in some aspects, but I'm glad with how it ended. It could've been worse!

[tekblade]

yeah i guess it was right for her to go home since her life is back there

[Eternity]

Imagine, 39 GLORIOUS episodes of Escaflowne.....:inlove: :kawaii: It could have been even more interesting if they'd only kept all of it.:dance:

[VanHitomi4ever]

:bawling: :bawling: :bawling: :bawling: :bawling: :kaioken: :kaioken: :sweatdrop :sweatdrop :( :( Oh, I was so disappointed! If I thought rationally about the ending long enough, maybe I would consent......ok, I wouldn't! She should have stayed! I'm a hopeless romantic, and I say she should have stayed! I would have! At the VERY least, they should have kissed! Oh, how I can picture that! It did leave room for a sequel, though--I'll be one of the first to buy it! And I did think that the ending cleared up everyone's issues--even the Allen/Millerna thing. They agreed to respect and stay away from one another--good for both of them. Anyway, I'll stop now. :o

[Kodachi]

*kicks thread*

The ending was the best thing about Escaflowne.

Err, I don't mean that as a shot at Esca ^^;

[waterfireGirl]

bah humbug

[tekblade]

hehe, hmm 39 huh i wonder :lol: maybe there saving their kiss in another sequel :heh:

[Eternity]

erm, t don't mean to be a party pooper or anything, and i haven't seen the film yet so ppl who have don't spoil it for the rest of us ok? :finger: But anyway, i read some bits about what happens in the film A Girl on Gaea, on an esca site, and the ending wasn't exactly a 'perfect' one. :bawling: and like i said, no spoilers please! (that's all i know).

[tekblade]

um i guess im sorry if i ruined anything for ya :heh: but its just an innocent thread for ppl to tell me what they gotta say in their opinion. again im sorry if this thread ruined anything for u :D maybe u could try and avoid it hehe :lol:

[TigerCat]

Does anyone think that a sequel is already in the works? (Maybemaybemaybeihopeihopeihope) :heh:



~~~~
www.page.com/tigercat1313

[tekblade]

hmm i kinda doubt it :D

[Shenrezade]

The fact that the ending was so bad when the rest of the series was so good just made it worse!! My first idea, that they gave it an Eva complex, was cut short when I found out Esca was made befor Eva. So now, I think the whole episode was just an excuse for Allen and Van to fight each other. And I'm sorry, but it just wasn't that cool!!! They didn't even have a plot-worthy reason to fight!! It's like the design team threw away everything that made the series good!! And another thing, Van and Hitomi went through too much s*** to have her say "I'll never forget you" and go home. She didn't even realize she loved Van until the final episode!! So, I made this short little "alternate" ending:

*Three months after Hitomi returned to Earth*

It's a park scene, there's bench beside a lake. Hitomi sits on it, feeling lonely. She is thinking about Van, while people pass her by, unconcerned.

Hitomi: I know it was for the best, but I miss him. I wonder what he's doing....

We see the feet of someone walking through the park. The throng of people moving past him give up mutters of his strange clothes, but dismiss him as one of those cosplay buffs. We see the feet stop next to the bench, where Hitomi still sits, not noticing her present company

???: This is a beautiful lake. You must like it.

Hitomi doesn't respond, only nodding silently, not really paying attention. The stranger tries again.

???: You know, it reminds me of the time we met Allen. As I recall, you were attacked by that mole man, right?

Hitomi gasps, and whips her head towards the speaker. The camera moves up, revealing brown boots, beige pants, and a red, sleeveless shirt worn by a boy with black, ruffled hair, looking at the lake.

Hitomi: V...Van....?

The boy turns and addresses Hitomi, and smiles: Yes, Hitomi? What is it?

Hitomi can't speak, she just smiles, with tears of joy, then launches herself at Van, who takes her in an embrace.

Hitomi: I thought I'd never see you again....

Van: I said it before, didn't I? I'd never let you get away again....

They separate, and then kiss each other.

Well, that's it. Maybe a little mushy, but I think it's better than the "Don't worry, I'm doing just fine" ending we got. What do you think?

[Sheex, The Dark Stalker]

>>The fact that the ending was so bad when the rest of the series was so good just made it worse!! My first idea, that they gave it an Eva complex, was cut short when I found out Esca was made befor Eva. So now, I think the whole episode was just an excuse for Allen and Van to fight each other.

Start paying attention. Allen was protecting Dilandau, who was actually his sister. In addition, the Fate Redirector Machine didn't forget to effect them as well. Finally, the fight shows how much Van has matured in his fighting through the series and shows a nice end of the series duel since the war was pretty much done with.

>>And I'm sorry, but it just wasn't that cool!!! They didn't even have a plot-worthy reason to fight!! It's like the design team threw away everything that made the series good!!

How!? They didn't throw anything away! The great animation remained. The great music remained. The relationships were resolved. Hitomi did what she wanted to do the entire series! Whats wrong with that!?


>>And another thing, Van and Hitomi went through too much s*** to have her say "I'll never forget you" and go home. She didn't even realize she loved Van until the final episode!!

Thats why the show is so good. It shows a real relationship develop, unlike the one between Allen and Hitomi where it was just Hitomi having a crush on him and Hitomi reminding Allen of his sister. If they were in love with each other like in the last episode in the first or second episode, the show's quality would be nowhere where it is now and a lot of the character development would be axed!

There's only one problem with the ending. The big war was ultra-rushed, with that stupid bomb used to save them the time of showing a bigger battle. You can' t really blame them, seeing that Sunrise just conveniently said "Oh yeah, we're yanking 13 episodes from the show" after a bunch of episodes were already made.

[Callisto]

I thought the ending was sad at first, but after it made perfect sense. I wouldn't have been able to stay on Gaea either. It also opens up interesting doors to a future series (if there is one).:D

[Shenrezade]

You raise good points, Sheex. I'm glad we can have a legible discussion. Unlike your chats with some people. (*cough* Black_Knight!!*cough*) I did know that Allen was protecting his sister, But he chose to fight Van. I really think that Van would have left her alone if Allen had told Van a bit more than he did about Dilandu. I also knew that the F.A. machine was affecting them, which kinda supports my theory about the whole episode being an excuse for Allen and Van to fight each other. And, in my opinion, Van didn't need to beat Allen. There wasn't a reason to reslove a duel in the first place.
Secondly, when I said they threw away everthing that made the series good, I was talking plot-wise. I wasn't sure what I was expecting to see as a final episode, but from what the plot gave me, I know it wasn't that. I know, it's my bad that I don't have a reason. I got some, but I can't remeber what they are. What do you mean, though, when you said Hitomi did what she wanted to do?
Please don't think I'm bashing the relationship developement between Van and Hitomi. I think it's the best I've seen in any anime so far. I'm just saying because of that, they deserve to stay together, physically. I don't think Hitomi should have stayed on Gaea, but Van could have at least gone to her in the flesh, rather than the metaphysical.
You know, though, I wonder why Sunrise yanked those episodes. Think what Escaflowne would be like if they weren't yanked. Would it be better? Or worse? Shall we continue this debate of ours, Sheex?

[tekblade]

hmm just curious what episodes yanked out?

[Sheex, The Dark Stalker]

Originally posted by Shenrezade
You raise good points, Sheex. I'm glad we can have a legible discussion. Unlike your chats with some people. (*cough* Black_Knight!!*cough*) I did know that Allen was protecting his sister, But he chose to fight Van. I really think that Van would have left her alone if Allen had told Van a bit more than he did about Dilandu. I also knew that the F.A. machine was affecting them, which kinda supports my theory about the whole episode being an excuse for Allen and Van to fight each other. And, in my opinion, Van didn't need to beat Allen. There wasn't a reason to reslove a duel in the first place.
I think if the whole episode was an excuse for them to fight, then the stuff that was built up through the series wouldn't have happened and the fight would have been longer than the 2-3 minutes that it was :P Due to Van's current state of mind with his brother dying mere minutes ago, I highly doubt he would have left that dismembered red Guymelef alone unless Serena suddenly came out of there and showed him that she was no longer Dilandau. Since Van had no idea of that, it makes perfect sense for him to want to kill Dilandau, and think that Allen is crazy for protecting him. After all, it was Dilandau who ordered Fanelia to be burnt to the ground, wouldn't you be a little upset and eager to go through anyone who got in your way? :P0


Secondly, when I said they threw away everthing that made the series good, I was talking plot-wise. I wasn't sure what I was expecting to see as a final episode, but from what the plot gave me, I know it wasn't that. I know, it's my bad that I don't have a reason. I got some, but I can't remeber what they are. What do you mean, though, when you said Hitomi did what she wanted to do?

Give reasons instead of senseless criticism. What the series was trying to say was that there is no such thing as predetermined fate, its something that each person must create on their own. And thats exactly what the final episode showed. All the relationships were resolved, the big war on Gaea was resolved (in an insanely fast method unfortunately), etc... As for your question, Hitomi wanted to go home the entire series, thats what she did. :P

Please don't think I'm bashing the relationship developement between Van and Hitomi. I think it's the best I've seen in any anime so far. I'm just saying because of that, they deserve to stay together, physically. I don't think Hitomi should have stayed on Gaea, but Van could have at least gone to her in the flesh, rather than the metaphysical.
There is nothing in the final episode that doesn't say they can't see each other whenever they want. Van and Hitomi are from 2 different worlds, and I don't think, atleast in this point in time that either should abandon their particular life in their home world.
You know, though, I wonder why Sunrise yanked those episodes. Think what Escaflowne would be like if they weren't yanked. Would it be better? Or worse? Shall we continue this debate of ours, Sheex?
Escaflowne was originally going to be a 39 episode series. The creators wrote up the entire plot, story, etc... then went into production. The ratings weren't too good after the first few episodes put on the air, so Sunrise decided that they would remove the final 13 episodes from the show. While this resulted in the pacing of the show to be extremely fast after episode 12 or so, it also is the reason for Escaflowne having no filler whatsoever. So its a mixed blessing. Its good that every single scene in the show is important to the story/characters somehow, but at the same time plenty of those episodes in the second half of the series deserved a little more than just the single episode worth of time that they were given.

[Shenrezade]

I agree that if no one had stopped him, Van would've cut Dilandu to pieces, but Dilandu wouldn't have turned into Celena in the first place, either. The fate alteration machine messed up Allen, as well as Van. Did he say "Zaibach experimented on her and turned her into Dilandu"? did he say "I haven't just found my sister only to lose her again"? And he didn't say "please try to understand, Van! She's all I have, now!" either. He said "Her crimes are mine, now fight me to the best of your ability, or I'll kill you" or at least something along those lines. With a flick of his sword he could've disarmed Van and gotten Celena out of there, but he didn't. He tried to kill him. Him fighting Van had nothing to do with protecting his sister. She was just the excuse he needed that started it.

The final episode said that mankind has a love for war and bloodshed, but love could break that attachment to war. It didn't say there was no such thing as "pre-determined fate." Here's some reasons that I forgot in my last post(I finally remebered some!!) What role did Escaflowne play in the ending? All through the series Escaflowne seemed to have an important role, that would be shown in the final episode, but it went haywire and Van dumped it. Then, during the final moments, he removes the energist and says "Thanks, Escaflowne." FOR WHAT!!? For letting me down!!? Also, what did Hitomi need to be saved from? She wasn't in any danger, as far as I saw. I was expecting her to be in some situation like Deedlit was when Parn rescued her in the Lodoss OVA. However, all that happens is that she and Issac have a little chat. The uneccessary fight, as I mentioned. And an answer of whether Millerna loved Dryden or Allen at the end. Don't tell me she didn't love Dryden, cause she got some feelings for him after she got to know him. Are those solid reasons? And, yes, at the beginning she wanted to go home, but when she got home she wanted to go back, because she missed her friends and was worried about them. And at teh very end, she wanted to stay with Van. She said, "I want to see it (the Gaea without war) with you. Or can I?" So what she wanted to do changed at the end.

I'm not saying that they should abandon their lives in their home worlds at that point in time, either. I'm saying that at the very end, after the credits, time should have passed, and they should've shown Van and Hitomi get together, instead of the image of Van that Hitomi sees on the rocks, after she goes back. Tell me the truth, do you think they deserved to be separated from each other after everything they went through to realize their love for each other?

I don't know if you know it or not, but there was a PS game of Escaflowne, that told the story of Escaflowne in an interactive way. However, it had scenes that weren't in the show. Do you think the game had the parts that were cut from the show? I'd like to find out. Well, I think you have the board, now, Mr. Sheex.


:D

[Sheex, The Dark Stalker]

Originally posted by Shenrezade
I agree that if no one had stopped him, Van would've cut Dilandu to pieces, but Dilandu wouldn't have turned into Celena in the first place, either. The fate alteration machine messed up Allen, as well as Van. Did he say "Zaibach experimented on her and turned her into Dilandu"? did he say "I haven't just found my sister only to lose her again"? And he didn't say "please try to understand, Van! She's all I have, now!" either. He said "Her crimes are mine, now fight me to the best of your ability, or I'll kill you" or at least something along those lines. With a flick of his sword he could've disarmed Van and gotten Celena out of there, but he didn't. He tried to kill him. Him fighting Van had nothing to do with protecting his sister. She was just the excuse he needed that started it.
Which is what I'm trying to say :P Its not a useless battle, its a battle caused by Van's intent to kill Dilandau/Serena, Allen's attempts to protect him/her, and the Fate Redirector Machine magnifying their feelings so much that these 2 friends would fight each other like so. And no, Allen never said anything about killing Van.
------
Van: Allen.
Allen: Don't, Van! Draw back your sword!
Van: He's possessed by fighting. I'll kill him to eliminate the root of the evil on Gaea!
Allen: No! Even if you kill Dilandau, people won't be free from grief!
Van: What?
//Van swipes at Allen.
Van: How can you understand the sadness of someone who lost his country?!
Allen: I'll be your opponent. Dilandau is my sister!
//Allen blocks Van's attack.
Van: Allen, have you gone crazy?
Allen: Her sin is my sin, even though she was controlled by Zaibach's black magic. You don't have to hold back! Defeat me! Fight me, Van Fanel! The Knight of Heaven, Allen Schezar, will fight you as best as I can!
-------
Van showed no intention of stopping his assault on Dilandau, so Allen had no choice but to protect his sister by fighting Van. The dialogue supports me :P



The final episode said that mankind has a love for war and bloodshed, but love could break that attachment to war. It didn't say there was no such thing as "pre-determined fate."

Actually, they did mention it, Hitomi said something along the lines of that in the last episode :P The message that the show tried to portray is that fate is caused by the actions of people. Its not something that is set in stone, it can be changed. They don't spell out everything for ya, you gotta look a little deeper in to it. Granted, its not a Lain or Evangelion in philisophical terms, but its no DBZ either.


Here's some reasons that I forgot in my last post(I finally remebered some!!) What role did Escaflowne play in the ending? All through the series Escaflowne seemed to have an important role, that would be shown in the final episode, but it went haywire and Van dumped it.

Van was the important element, not Escaflowne. I thought they made that pretty clear too :P Dornkirk was simply scared of Escaflowne because he had visions of it destoying Zaibach. Van was the important 'dragon' role, and in the end it was he who ended up disabling the Atlantis machine.

Then, during the final moments, he removes the energist and says "Thanks, Escaflowne." FOR WHAT!!? For letting me down!!?

Oh I don't know... Only a mech to pilot for 25 episodes, I guess Van owes Escaflowne no gratitude.


Also, what did Hitomi need to be saved from? She wasn't in any danger, as far as I saw. I was expecting her to be in some situation like Deedlit was when Parn rescued her in the Lodoss OVA. However, all that happens is that she and Issac have a little chat.

Van didn't go to rescue her, he just went to be with her again. They never potrayed it as something vital and important in the first place, if so I think they would have spent more time on that oh so short scene -_-


And an answer of whether Millerna loved Dryden or Allen at the end. Don't tell me she didn't love Dryden, cause she got some feelings for him after she got to know him.
She couldn't decide between the 2 of them for most of the series, why do you think she'd suddenly make up her mind? Escaflowne doesn't suddenly make its characters act out of character like other shows :P


Are those solid reasons? And, yes, at the beginning she wanted to go home, but when she got home she wanted to go back, because she missed her friends and was worried about them. And at teh very end, she wanted to stay with Van. She said, "I want to see it (the Gaea without war) with you. Or can I?" So what she wanted to do changed at the end.
What, this whole "No!!!! Hitomi went home!!! The endings ruined!!" argument again? I've had enough of this, watch the episodes from beginning to end CAREFULLY and you'll understand her feelings better.


I'm not saying that they should abandon their lives in their home worlds at that point in time, either. I'm saying that at the very end, after the credits, time should have passed, and they should've shown Van and Hitomi get together, instead of the image of Van that Hitomi sees on the rocks, after she goes back. Tell me the truth, do you think they deserved to be separated from each other after everything they went through to realize their love for each other?
They can't all have ultra-happy everyone gets together type endings. Thats what I like about Escaflowne's ending. Its realistic. Hitomi isn't going to suddenly abandon everyone on Earth to be with Van, who she loved for a grand total of THREE episodes (and didn't admit it til the finale). Escaflowne's great at showing how their relationship developed, but this isn't a perfect world and who knows if they'd be the perfect couple years away. Thats why they didn't go showing them in their 20's being together. Besides, don't you think the ending they used would result in a better sequel if they ever decided to make one? (which they have expressed interest in BTW) :D


I don't know if you know it or not, but there was a PS game of Escaflowne, that told the story of Escaflowne in an interactive way. However, it had scenes that weren't in the show. Do you think the game had the parts that were cut from the show? I'd like to find out. Well, I think you have the board, now, Mr. Sheex.
:D
No, the game's got nothing to do with the series' plot at all and features animation not as good as the series' :P You can see pics/scripts at my website: http://www.escaflowneonline.com/game/

[Shenrezade]

Actually, Allen caught Van's attention by saying that Dilandu was his sister. When Van said "Are you crazy?" Ithink he meant in the sense of "Dilandu's a guy!" Explaining this more might have ended the battle. Instead, Allen urged Van to fight him, and had every intention of killing Van, just as Van wanted to kill Allen. It started as a meaningful battle, but quickly degenerated into a useless brawl. Even Issac said it. "It is what they wish."

As I recall, Issac said that he was unable to control fate after all. Hitomi replied "Are you giving up? I don't believe in pre-determined fate." That has nothing to do with it. When Van came for Hitomi, their love for each other was so strong, it was able to undo the effect of the Zone of Absolute Fortune. Issac said "Can it be that their love for each other can surpass even man's love for war?" Sadly, I haven't seen Lain yet. It's much easier to comprehend than Eva, also. Or was that what you meant? And, while I like DBZ, please don't ever mention it in the same sentence as Escaflowne! :eek2:

Sorry about that, my bad:agree:

I can't see him saying thanks merely for that. And besides, It almost killed him! TWICE!!

What do you mean they never showed it as anything vital in the first place? What do you think they were building up to during the whole second half of the series!? Van and Hitomi were what broke the Atlantis machine. Neither one could have done it separately. Van felt that Hitomi was in trouble and desparately needed to get to her(I still don't know why.) If he merely wanted to see her again he wouldn't have put as much importance on it as he did.

For the beginning she liked Allen. Crap, she even said she'd dump her own country for him!! And at first she didn't care much for Dryden, up until she found out Allen had a kid, and that Dryden wasn't the letcher she thought he was. I think she realized she admired Allen, rather than loved him. After they got married, she started liking Dryden more, but this might have been because Allen was paying attention to Hitomi. Then, Dryden, in a great act, realizes that neither of them are ready yet, and decides to split up, to give her more time to think up her decision.
After that, we never see him again. What happens?

In case you forgot, the entire series was about the relationship between Van and Hitomi. The writer said as much. I never thought the ending was ruined, I just thought it was bad that she never got to stay with Van. I know she wanted to, and I also know she knew they both had responsiblities (for the time being) on their own worlds. But that shouldn't have caused them to give up each other entirely.

She didn't love Van for a grand total of three episodes. She had feelings for him for most of the series, she just wasn't sure of them, and felt like Van didn't share those feelings. (Boy was she ever wrong.) Need I remind you that the episode is called "Eternal Love?" Their love for each other was something that would never die, and could cross any boundary. Why, then, should it have to cross those for all eternity? And by the way, I know the writer reeeeeaallly wants to make a sequel, but I doubt sunrise, being themselves, would ever agree to it. I mean, these are the people who shot down 13 episodes of Escaflowne, and canceled Big O right when the series hit break-neck speed in the story(I wanna know what happens next, dammit!!), among other things. Their thinking would be "What? Escaflowne? We already did that!"

Really? I thought it did. It does have Merle, Allen, Hitomi, and the rest of the crew, doesn't it? Is it like some sort of omake plot, or something, then?

I'm betting this is one of your better discussions, isn't it Sheex?

[Sheex, The Dark Stalker]

Originally posted by Shenrezade
What do you mean they never showed it as anything vital in the first place?
Hitomi's need to be rescued from there. She obviously wasn't in any danger a la other parts of the series when she was in trouble.

She didn't love Van for a grand total of three episodes. She had feelings for him for most of the series, she just wasn't sure of them, and felt like Van didn't share those feelings. (Boy was she ever wrong.) Need I remind you that the episode is called "Eternal Love?" Their love for each other was something that would never die, and could cross any boundary. Why, then, should it have to cross those for all eternity?

Hitomi couldn't really admit to herself that she was in love with Van until late in the series and for most of the first 23 episodes her crush on Allen hindered most of the chance than Van ever had :P As much as I like their relationship, I think people at this board/the now-deceased Anime Shack board have a tendency to overrate it to an insane extent. And outside of the episode title, there's no attempt to put off the relationship as some eternal, crossing all bounds, will never end relationship. :P Not bashing it or anything, it is my fave anime after all, but I think people go a little too overboard on this ending thing.

Thats all :P

[Shenrezade]

So then you agree with me about Hitomi not being in any danger, then?

Precisely my point. They didn't do anything with Van's and Hitomi's relationship other than the image of Van on the rocks. As Hurricane Helmsley says (btw he is the only reason that I watch wrestling. He parodies it like no one else.) "What's up wit dat?" After everything they went through, it derserved a little more screen time time than Sunrise gave it. I wonder if any of the yanked episodes had more in them.....

Ah, yes, before I forget. Dornkirk, and various others, stated that Escaflowne was a key element to Altlantis technology. It also performed several strange things over the course of the anime. Yet, they never really finished this idea. Once the idea of Hitomi affecting the FA machine struck the scriptwriters, Escaflowne's connection with Atlantis was utterly dropped with no conclusion. WHAT IS ESCAFLOWNE'S LINK WITH ATLANTIS!!?

Have we reached a common ground, or should we move on, Sheex?

[Sheex, The Dark Stalker]

Originally posted by Shenrezade
So then you agree with me about Hitomi not being in any danger, then?

Precisely my point. They didn't do anything with Van's and Hitomi's relationship other than the image of Van on the rocks. As Hurricane Helmsley says (btw he is the only reason that I watch wrestling. He parodies it like no one else.) "What's up wit dat?" After everything they went through, it derserved a little more screen time time than Sunrise gave it. I wonder if any of the yanked episodes had more in them.....
Eww... Hurricane Helms? Can't stand him, thank god he's gone :D No episodes were yanked, they just had to rush everything in the second half of the series. Its not that footage was made, then never aired, the footage was never made in the first place even though it was originally planned in the story.

Ah, yes, before I forget. Dornkirk, and various others, stated that Escaflowne was a key element to Altlantis technology. It also performed several strange things over the course of the anime. Yet, they never really finished this idea. Once the idea of Hitomi affecting the FA machine struck the scriptwriters, Escaflowne's connection with Atlantis was utterly dropped with no conclusion. WHAT IS ESCAFLOWNE'S LINK WITH ATLANTIS!!? You're right, something they didn't explain enough :P But as the series reached its end, the focus on Escaflowne pretty much dropped off, so atleast you can't say they were talking about how important Escaflowne was in episode 25, then forgot about it in episode 26.

Have we reached a common ground, or should we move on, Sheex?
Yep, I think this is pretty much resolved :P

[Westlo]

Shenrezade why do you have the impression that escaflowne did nothing at all for Van.

Escaflowne saved Van's ass on many occasions and how else was he going to combat the zaibach melefs? hand to hand maybe :P

I could go on and list how many times escaflowne saved his butt, but i can't be bothered

[Shenrezade]

Ah, I see. I thought they had already made the episodes and then Sunrise yanked them. Gomen ne. Good point with the Escaflowne importance thing. :agree: Well, that was fun!! ::D

I'm not saying that Escaflowne didn't do anything for Van, Westlo. I'm just saying I can't see him saying "Thanks Escaflowne" at the end of the series, as if Escaflowne did something impoortant that saved everyone on Gaea recently.
Escaflowne still almost killed Van twice, though. But maybe I'm just nitpicking. I just resolved this with Sheex and aren't very eager to start it up again right now.

[Westlo]

too bad i feel like arguing :p

So you're saying that you wouldn't thank something that has enabled you to gain revenge and save the world over the course of a long period of time. Even though escaflowne stuffed up in the end it symbolised that van didn't need escaflowne anymore and could do stuff himself.

He thanked it for the help it gave him and as a good bye to escaflowne which he was going to bury.

As for it nearly killed him twice, if it wasn't for escaflowne van would have been dead in ep two. I'll take escaflowne and the risks it posed than dieing, wouldn't you?

[Shenrezade]

Correction. If it weren't for Hitomi, Van would be dead in episode 2. Heck, he'd be dead in episode one, for crying out loud!! But then again, we wouldn't be debating about this if that had happened. Maybe I'm just splitting hairs.

Maybe I'd take the risks, but I wouldn't have tried to merge with it if I had known it was going to do that. Van piloted Escaflowne perfectly fine before merging with it, and all that really happened was that he ended up getting wounded. I don't see that as a fair exchange, do you?

Also, he could've said something more aside from just thanks. Like, thanks for all the help you gave me, but now you can rest? I'm just saying that they made it seem, as I said, like Escaflowne had done something worth thanking it for recently. And why would you say thank you for getting abandoned and learning that you don't need it?

I should've listened to my mom when she said to join the debate team. :D

[Westlo]

Originally posted by Shenrezade
Correction. If it weren't for Hitomi, Van would be dead in episode 2. Heck, he'd be dead in episode one, for crying out loud!! But then again, we wouldn't be debating about this if that had happened. Maybe I'm just splitting hairs.
escaflpwne saves van and hitomis as much as hitomi saves van

Maybe I'd take the risks, but I wouldn't have tried to merge with it if I had known it was going to do that. Van piloted Escaflowne perfectly fine before merging with it, and all that really happened was that he ended up getting wounded. I don't see that as a fair exchange, do you?
and be killed by the dragonslayers instead k if thats what you want


Also, he could've said something more aside from just thanks. Like, thanks for all the help you gave me, but now you can rest? I'm just saying that they made it seem, as I said, like Escaflowne had done something worth thanking it for recently. And why would you say thank you for getting abandoned and learning that you don't need it?
lets see escaflowne didn't do anything worth a thanks between episodes 2-25 nah not any i can recall


I should've listened to my mom when she said to join the debate team. :D
no not really

[Shenrezade]

True, but aren't we debating about a different subject?

But I was saying that Van defeated the Dragonslayers perfectly fine before merging with the Escaflowne. What did he need to merge with it for? Aside from wounding him when it got hurt, it also increased his desire to fight, which was why he went ballistic against the dragonslayers in episode 14. I know Van didn't like it very much after he realized what he did.

Again, I said that the writers made it sound like he thanked Escaflowne for something recently, as in episode 24 or 25. If he was saying thanks for all the help it gave it him up until that point, he should have said so. And if it helped him to realize he didn't need to rely on it, he also should've said so. But just saying "thanks" and nothing more sounds like it saved Gaea in the Last Battle, which it didn't. Van and Hitomi did that.

Respect My Authoritah!!