The alien

[Commander Fuyutsuki]

Int he epidode hat starts off talking about Roswell, whats the point of the alien watching lain from the doorway?

[BigShot Jordan]

I didn't really get that either.That freaked me out though!

[StramiT]

My original thought was that it was the aliens behind the merging of the wired and the real world.

[Petit Charat]

WERE they aliens? Or just something from the wired? That is what i question.

[Ura]

I just saw that as a reflection of

a) the conspiracy nuts of the wired, perhaps even a product of Knights.

b) a reflection of how alien everything weas to her. She was of nwither the real world or the wired. There were elements pulling her to both but she never belonged to either

[heart havok]

though many of you may not agree with this... i am almost 100% positive this is a FACT.

upon Lain's early expeditions thru-out the Wired, we hear a lady screaming of a KID with Green and Red stripped clothes on. later, we hear this again. later, we SEE this being in the physical form of an "Alien" step into Lain's room, and STARE at her.

i believe that this is Lain SEEING HERSELF. thus, an "Alien" image. at this point in the story, Lain doesn't know what she is, this is when she is most questioning herself and her existnese. this "Alien" {if i am correct} would be known as "LAINsmall" [*see later for more on "LAINsmall"]... thru-out the story, we are confronted with many different versions of Lain... there is LAINwired, which is Lain within the Wired... LAINpast which is young Lain talking with the Doll in LAYER:05... there is LAINevil, which is she who peeps Arisu... there is LAINsmall, which will be spoken of later... and there is LAIN, who is Lain. upon being introduced to these different versions of Lain, we are also {possibly, and IF my theories are correct} most likely traveling, or SEARCHING {if you will} thru many different possible "realities"... upon these Searches, it is highly possible that Lain could bump into herself correct? of course not... because Lain is running the Search, thus sh will DECIDE upon whether or not to find herself... Lain doesnot KNOW about herself, thus she can't find any information on herself without her own Journey for Personal Discovery... {a main theme to the Series}

so who is this LAINsmall? LAINsmall is the version of Lain who is trying to correct everything... LAINsmall is the version of LAIN who wants to hang on to hope while Lain wants to give up. LAINsmall is the version of Lain who walks into Arisu's room and has the body and clothes of the "Alien," but the head of Lain. the head showing us {the audience} that this IS Lain and the body connecting the two together {"two" being LAINsmall and the "Alien"}...

finally... so why is it that Lain sees this "Alien" version of herself? because LAINsmall is checking up on Lain. if Lain is a watcher and is meant to watch others, then who watches Lain other than herself?





..now... if i didn't just straighten out all your questions on the matter, then i'm most certain that i have atleast fucked your mind beyond the confusion it was already suffering. and for that... you are more than welcome. ^_^

[Commander Fuyutsuki]

Believe it or notr but I actually understood that, thanks havok.

[Drizzten]

I wonder why the alien was choosen. Why use the imagery of an alien to represent the hopeful and do-good side of Lain? What do you think of the overview of Roswel and the other alien-related scenes in the series? Are they related to LainSmall's efforts to come into our world to fix things?

[Kannibal]

Ummm... I didn't see anything that complicated.

To put it simply :
1. Lain believes the Roswell story
2. Lain thinks aliens exist
3. Lain creates the alien and sees it. She has the power to do it, even unintentionally.

That's what you start to realize that she can do whatever she wants, as silly as it may seem.

No need to see twisted plots and hidden messages everywhere... :-)

[heart havok]

Originally posted by Drizzten
I wonder why the alien was choosen. Why use the imagery of an alien to represent the hopeful and do-good side of Lain? What do you think of the overview of Roswel and the other alien-related scenes in the series?

i personally believe that it is an "Alien" simply to signify that in THAT POINT of the story, LAINsmall is "Alien" to Lain.

i believe that the uses of the Roswell insident are inserted into the series for many reasons...
1. to throw you off.
2. because the first person who signed the document has a relation to Eiri.
3. because that person who is related to Eiri is also the person who took responsibilities for "hypothesizing" the theory of Planetary EMP and Networking.
4. because the "information" that was believed as a FACT was FACTUALLY false, thus creating that information into INFORNOGRAPHY.

..there are a few.

Originally posted by Drizzten
Are they related to LainSmall's efforts to come into our world to fix things?
i hadn't thought of that one before, but now that you mention it, i believe it to be DAMN TRUE as well. good job.

Originally posted by Kannibal
Ummm... I didn't see anything that complicated.

To put it simply :
1. Lain believes the Roswell story
2. Lain thinks aliens exist
3. Lain creates the alien and sees it. She has the power to do it, even unintentionally.

That's what you start to realize that she can do whatever she wants, as silly as it may seem.

No need to see twisted plots and hidden messages everywhere... :-)

not silly... that is doubtlessly another possibility.. however, i don't see any valid statement in the story implying at all that Lain believes the Roswell story. NOR that she believes Aliens exist. AND if that were the case, then why would YOU explain that LAINsmall half Alien, half Lain???

of course there is no NEED to see the way i do, but this is simply the was i SEE. besides, i am clearly getting more out of hte Series than you are, so i am much more satasfied with my eyes, thank you.

[Kannibal]

Originally posted by heart havok

of course there is no NEED to see the way i do, but this is simply the was i SEE. besides, i am clearly getting more out of hte Series than you are, so i am much more satasfied with my eyes, thank you.

Damn right, nothing like good old self-satisfaction.

Thank you for taking the time to enlighten all of us (and me especially) with your particulary sharp mind.
I now look upon the series with a whole new perspective.

Truly you are much more clever and intelligent than me, and I cannot possibly imagine how I could outsmart someone as bright.

I bow to your prowess and your wisdom.

Thank you

PS: Oh... And just in case you thought I was serious, here's the short version : :finger:

[Drizzten]

Kannibal, let me say something real quick before this goes further. Havok's writing style can make it seem he levels a verbal gun at you and empties a clip in your direction. Please don't let it bother you. We all had to adapt...;)

Havok...*shakes head*...haven't changed a bit...

Anyway, Havok, your first block of responses makes sense now. Thanks.

[Kannibal]

Originally posted by Drizzten
Kannibal, let me say something real quick before this goes further. Havok's writing style can make it seem he levels a verbal gun at you and empties a clip in your direction. Please don't let it bother you. We all had to adapt...;)

Ok... I stand corrected.

But people who point a gun at me - verbal or otherwise - should watch for returning autofire...

See ya elsethread... :)

[heart havok]

Kannibal, you clearly took everything i said the wrong way, and took it up the ass instead... all i was saying is that i am looking into Serial Experiments Lain with my perspective, and i am happy to have my own perspective. i enjoy all that i get out of Serial Experiments Lain, and i was simply stating that i'm not asking you to agree with me at all. in fact, i'm more-so happy that you don't because it's perspectives like yours that help me to appreciate my perspective on things. thank you again.

[Kannibal]

Originally posted by heart havok
Kannibal, you clearly took everything i said the wrong way, and took it up the ass instead...
I did ??? Oh well, that didn't hurt a bit, you're so small I didn't feel anything...

in fact, i'm more-so happy that you don't because it's perspectives like yours that help me to appreciate my perspective on things. thank you again.
You're welcome...
I'm glad to add one more person to my list of satisfied customers (while you can definitely remove me from yours).

Ok, let's cut the "Mine's bigger than yours" bulls**t and return to some serious posts, else I'm afraid this could go on forever...

Sorry folks, you REALLY don't have to read this crap...

[Drizzten]

Does anyone else feel the sneaking suspicion that the green and red stripes on the alien's shirt might mean something? In the western world, green and red are commonly associated with Christmas, winter, etc. Do you think the producers were going for that effect? If so, what would that symbolize? Lain as a giver, as a uniter (you know, bringing the family together under the holiday), as a transition from one period (Dead fall) to another (Life spring)?

[Commander Fuyutsuki]

Kinda like

Red could symbolize pain, destruction, anger, and haterd

Green can symbolize healing, peace, and (cant think of one at the moment)

You think those red and green stripes could have a meaning like for example, red could be destruction and green healing. The shirt being a red/green stripe pattern could be showing the constant cycle of destruction and healing/restoration.

I guess I'll quit spouting of my ignorance now

[Dryden-san]

I have heard a number of different theories about the alien, including that it may be a hallucination caused by that liquid covering the floor of her room. Supposedly, it's liquid carbon, which can cause hallucinations. Or maybe they just decided to mention in passing that the internet may have come about as a result of alien technology.

Honestly, I think the alien was just a reference to all the conspiracy nuts on the Wired, and our own internet. Either way it doen't have any bearing on the main story. Havok's theory is interesting, though. Too bad we'll never know for sure.

[lain]

I think that the alien was created by the knights myself... I need to rewatch lain though.

[heart havok]

all that comes to my mind is Freddy Cougar.

[BlackXIII]

ack. mind hurting. I guess it all makes sense though. but why diden't lain have her face on the alien the 1st time we saw it? might it be because she dosen't know it's her?

hey, I have a question that goes off to a tangent thogh. I should probobly make it into its own thread thogh but here it goes. isn't liquid carbon REALLY hot? how can you use it the way Lain does?

[Drizzten]

From Physics News (http://newton.ex.ac.uk/aip/physnews.358.html):
LIQUID CARBON is difficult to produce because a sample of solid carbon, melted quickly by a laser, will want to repose back into the form of graphite. Physicists at the Russian Academy of Sciences (Moscow) have sought to melt carbon with picosecond laser pulses, and report the observation of a liquid phase, the evidence being the fleeting presence of periodic stripes in microscopic pictures of the tiny (200 micron) spots on a graphite surface under bombardment. The researchers argue that the stripes could not be present in a fully solid phase. The liquid is scarcely glimpsed, however, before it quickly solidifies, partly into an amorphous carbon structure.
Where did you see Lain using liquid carbon? I can't remember...

As for your first question, your guess is as good as mine. It could be a symbol of Lain's confusion about her true self/selves. A desire to remain anonymous after a lone period of recognition around the Wired.

[heart havok]

i could verywell be mistaken... but i recall Liquid Carbon being what Taro says she's using for her computer... LAYER:09 PROTOCOL

Originally from the fingers of Drizz
A desire to remain anonymous after a lone period of recognition around the Wired.

kinda' like when you've been around a group of people so long that you'd like a break from them...

[Drizzten]

Exactly...it's kind of like Lain using "faceless" chatting technology, like we do today. It could be symbolic for an avatar.

[monolith]

I wonder why the alien was choosen. Why use the imagery of an alien to represent the hopeful and do-good side of Lain?
maybe it's saying that hopeful and do-good are foreign to lain

What do you think of the overview of Roswel and the other alien-related scenes in the series?
don't know, that confused me a lot. perhaps it's symbolising the unknown in form of tangible [I use the term loosely] evidence.

[heart havok]

who are you quoting there, Monolith?

none the less... Drizz, Monolith...

:nod: AGREED :nod:

[Drizzten]

Why would being helpful be foreign to Lain?

[BlackXIII]

I think the Alien head means that Lain doesn’t know herself or Arisu doesn’t seem to know Lain. Lain seems fairly malleable (in her ability to accept information, and often confuses herself with it) so that is what the head represents (IMHO)

Taro asks Lain what she uses for a coolant when she takes Taro to her house(I can’t remember the episode) he then asks, “Is this liquid Carbon?” Or at least that what is says in the subtitles on my DVD

[monolith]

who are you quoting there, Monolith?
I was answering Drizzten's questions...I'm not sure of how to place a name for the quote.

Why would being helpful be foreign to Lain?
well...she seems so indifferent to a lot of stuff. She's introverted; she seldom interacts with others...so it's quite hard to be helpful if there is so little contact with others.

[heart havok]

Originally posted by Drizzten
Why would being helpful be foreign to Lain?

perhaps... not 'being helpful' is what's foreign to Lain, but rather the young and innocent Lain is becoming foreign to Lain.

[monolith]

perhaps... not 'being helpful' is what's foreign to Lain, but rather the young and innocent Lain is becoming foreign to Lain.
By saying innocent, do you mean in the context of childhood and adolescence [ie Lain as a human, growing pains, etc]?
or do you mean Lain as a product of the wired, or something else, discovering the truth?

[heart havok]

i mean in all senses.

as 'growing up', i believe it's more of a mental change rather than physical... but she's certainly maturing and developing - and especially by LAYER:09

her innocence is foreign in the sense that she isn't being able to live as a child. by reaching such involved experiences, she is having to mature much sooner than any regular thirteen year old girl would have to.

in a Wired sense, she is becoming moreso "Lain of the Wired" thus the innocent Lain of the past is what is foreign to her. her "Real Life body" {so to speak - loosly} is kinda' like the "old" Lain, and this new Lain doesn't recognise herself.


in addition to this theory, i explain the Alien later having the head of Lain as that she is recognising her previous 'self' thru her Wired self... the two are becoming ONE again. she is nearing her final denouement and realizing that Lain is Lain.... as through 'KNIGHTS' and 'DEUS', she seems to "lose" herself in possibility that there's another Lain, and she fumbles around with questions of who she truly is.




i could ramble on this topic, but i've a headache. -_-

[BlackXIII]

I understood almost all of that...except Deus. Couuld someone enlighten me on what that is again?

[Griffith]

Fascinating, Fascinating, Fascinating!

Heart havok, excellent theories, and Drizzten wonderful questions that lead to further discussion. I can't wait to watch my favorite series again, so that I can fully take part in these topics. Looks like I am going to enjoy myself here...heheh

[Wormy]

Originally posted by heart havok

ii could ramble on this topic, but i've a headache. -_-


Well, you've given me one.

[KeeblerElf]

The alien was really baffling, I was like "What the helll?!" Looks like I'm gonna have to watch Lain again. I would venture to say there IS a specific reason for that....but I dont know what it is yet..

[Wormy]

The only reason I see is to confuzzle the hell out of us.

[BlackXIII]

I don't think anything in Lain dosent mean anything

[iwakura]

I don't think anything in Lain dosent mean anything

There is a certain "Zen" quality to Lain which makes that question somewhat irrelevant.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

As well an any other question. There is a property of SEL that makes one's experience of it more important than one's analysis of it. This "East meets West" duality of SEL matches the surrealistic juxtapostion of the wired world with the physical world.

At least, that's how I experience it.

[BlackXIII]

IMHO The thing that makes Lain so special is all the symbolism and stuff and having people to descuss and argue it with. Just watching it seems to leave some hole in it somehow

[iwakura]

Hmmm. I did not notice a hollowness in Lain, but I've been a bit more prepared from reading a bit on eastern culture.

The Zen aspect to SEL might be easier to understand in terms of its roots. From China came Taoism. This is the mysticism that is very different different from our western understanding. Taoism + Buddism results in Zen.

From the Zen perspective, the lack of SEL making logical/rational sense isn't something to be argued about, but just accepted. i.e. the koan "What is the sound of one hand clapping"?

Not to say that I'm against agruing about stuff to learn more about it. But this particular series incorporates concepts that is completely contrary to such activities. It means that all logical arguments have to be taken with a grain of salt.

This is all more than a bit weird. If this was a purely western plot, contradictions are just that. In this plot, it may (or may not) be a reflection of the Zen influence where it serves the purpose of a koan.

The alien character adds an additional dimension to Lain, no matter what it is interpreted as. There is the innocent bear suit Lain and the not-so-innocent Lain of the wired. Nice yin-yang relationship there. The alien Lain messes this up. It could mean several things:

* The alien Lain represents that a non-earth influence is at work building upon all the UFO stuff mentioned in earlier episodes.

* The alien Lain is a projected image of Lain's psychological problems of not understanding what she is and/or how she doesn't fit in with regular people.

* A further hint that Lain represents the true cosmic Tao, something that is always changing, can be experienced to a degree, but can never be adequately described with words.

* Just something cool looking because the crew making SEL is into UFO stuff.

[Wormy]

Originally posted by iwakura

* Just something cool looking because the crew making SEL is into UFO stuff.

:lol:

[number41]

No, the crew is ok, but we (fans:trooper:) are aliens, because we're watching this wired anime :D

[number41]

sick , smile is wrong ;)
This ( :) ) should be this :trooper:

[heart havok]

[Wormy]

O...K...

[Id0]

I agree with heart havok here...
I dont belive Lain has anythign to do with 'extraterestrials'... but 'aliens' as in foregn entity in a place that it shouldnt be in...

I'm not convinced of this watcher thing... but i think Lain feels like an 'alien' in the 'world'...

As for the significance of the Roswell fotage...