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Old 01-07-2000, 05:01 AM   #1   [permalink]
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Join Date: 23 Jun 2000
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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(5/21/00 6:18:24 pm)
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Science Vs Relgion
First thing when I mention relgion here I mean Christanity!

In EVA their are many examples of Science and Relgion. I am an Atheist and recently attended a semanar about Science Vs Relgion... the speaker was also selling a book which I had to purchase. Of corse the discussion was bias and was focussing on the concept of Creationism. I was surprised by what was said.... of course I am always going to be an Atheist. Many farmers attended this meeting and most would not understand the ideas of Quantum Mechanics, Event Horizon's or even the idea of Gravity effecting time. These were some of the things mentioned in the book. Now I think that it was way to advanced for most of the farmers. But it did show me something that it is not a strickly Science versus relgion. It was more of Faith Vs Scientfic background. The speaker said that science is great and can explain things except it has to be based around the concept that God created us....

EVA has many relgious aspects but also has the level of technology in it to. Is this the same sort of thing. Is EVA not Really apposing either side Relgion or Science it is just showning how both sides have points. According to Relgion the Earth has been around for 30,000 years but according to Science has been around for billions of years. EVA shows the world has been around for millions of years but also speaks of Adam and Eve actually exsisting. So is EVA itself a walking contradition or is it an amagimation of both sides.

A T h 401
(5/21/00 11:05:39 pm)
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30000 years? your stratching it there, according to hardcore creationists the earth was created 4004bce, so its a little over 6000 years old now (of course i do not believe that!!!)

I never even saw Eva as science vs religion, both aspects were woven in so well it did not seen to me to be a contest between the two.

which brings me to off the subject type stuff- Alchemy

Alchemists are searching for the universal elixer, which has often been thought of as just the ability to turn lead into gold, but that was concidered to be a by-product of more important work. (Isreal Regardie's book Alchemy is a very good read on this)

But one phrase which crops up is
The Beauty which Nature creates through Art is perfected by Man through Science

Which gives you my opinion to- Is Eva itself a walking contradition or is it an amagimation of both sides.
I don t see Eva as a walking contridiction, but more of an itergrating of religion and science to further Mankind


(5/22/00 5:46:39 am)
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Well in EVA it's often mentioned that the Human's were messing with stuff they don't understand. They used science to clone Angels (Adam or Lilith) and built armour to contain/control them.

Religoin's usual rant would be that they didn't create anything, mearly harnesed existing power (humans didn't invent plutonium for example).

As for the "messing with forces we don't understand", how many of us know exatly how asprin works? Or a train? A computer? We take it on faith that the stuff works. Not faith in God but faith in Man.

(5/22/00 1:23:46 pm)
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Touchy subject... I tried to stay out of the previous thread about religious influences in Eva because of this, but this topic seems to beg itself somehow.

Who here enjoyed the novel/movie "Contact"? It's my absolute favorite, and my suspicion is that most of you did(if you haven't watched the movie yet, now you know what to borrow come that next rainy day). As far as I see it, "Contact" and NGE share several themes, such as science &/vs religion and man's struggle with the human condition. These issues are so deeply rooted in our nature, it's sometimes hard to maintain an objective view and to make clear judgments.

All that disclaimer stuff aside, I think there's ample room for science and religion to exist side-by-side. They are both anthropocentric systems of belief; science is about measurement and reliable re-production, and only "sees" what is within the reaches of what can be measured. If something is beyond the limits of and cannot be harnessed by modern technology, then science is "blind" to it. Just like religion is blind to anything except the word of g(G)od(s).
Still, it's undeniable that both have contributed to bringing mankind to where it is now, and both provide for essential aspects of our lives. Each complements what the other is missing. I think "Contact" captures this point well.
In the end, like ATh says, "I [don't] see Eva as a walking [contradiction], but more of an [integration] of religion and science to further Mankind". As far as I am concerned, the universe will go about its universal business no matter how mankind continues to pursue either enterprise. I'm not saying either/or is futile, it's just ~!how!~ man decides to pursue these enterprises.

The Nondescript
(5/22/00 3:01:15 pm)
Reply | Edit | Del 'I'm the alpha', 'I'm the beta', and 'I'm omega'.
This is another shining point in Eva.

Two very important fields for mankind in the future are brought together.

Man has science; 'Is that why they (the angels) are attacking us'-Stinji.
A constant thread in Eva is the triumph of science to make man what it is. 'The city a human creation'-Fuyu. But Shinji is terrified by the city in Hedgehog's dilemma. 'We are afraid of darkness and drive it away with light'-a philosophical Rei.

We see the power of Gods facing the power of science- 'that which makes man powerful' Gendo.
'It is that sort of arrogance that caused 2nd impact'-Fuyu
The efforts of both forces, God and Science, clash with all life at steak.

However, there is no religion in Eva comparable to any religion in our world. There is no Jesus in Eva but God like entities (shito). There is only the power of these beings and man who thru science wields God-like power. 'We have created a living God, what blasphemy'-Seele Monolith.
This makes the battles all the more powerful since we are not just fighting some aliens but dealing with an ultimate being(s) that begot us all.

God and science can coexist. If I say the univerese was created in a big bang with scientific arguements it can be believed that a God was the architect. Science will never adequately answer 'who am I?', such questions are where a religion or spirituality take over.

Man, do I ramble.

Artificial intelligence, cloning and space stations?,
Trying to build the tower of Babel well your'e sadly mistaken.-God
So watcha sayin then you the one who created sin?-The Vampire

(5/22/00 5:48:52 pm)
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Re: Science Vs Relgion
Well first thing to ATh 30,000 years was the estimate given by the dude at the Relgious seminar thing.

Also it is blasphemy for mankind to create. I think in the bible it says something that only God has the power to create life. Hence all the kick about Genetic engerneering by Relgious side.

And Contact, would be considered my Bible... anything written by the immortal Carl Sagan... will forever be held by me in the highest of respect. The point of that film was to show the two conflicting sides... how each one contains compontents of the other.

(6/5/00 3:32:31 pm)
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well i havent been on in a while...but heres my two cents worth...

religion had appeared as far back as 40000BC when palaeolithic man was alive but that type of religion was rather primitive and is considered the 'prototype' of other religions. it did not in anyway allude to when the earth was created since it was way too primitive.

and i think the point made about science and religion coexisting is valid, after all isaac newton developed his theories (most of which are fairly accurate)believing that the earth was created by god and revolved around him/her.

A T h 401
(6/6/00 10:28:30 pm)
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Yes Corpse, you havent been around for a while, what have you been up to?


(6/7/00 1:08:13 am)
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hehe, corpse haven't seen you in a while
be afraid... Admin cap is back... !
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