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Old 12-02-2006, 02:15 PM   #31   [permalink]
ACE2001
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Hmm...so you hate Emiya oppa? To be honest, I think he's was definately put in an impossible situation: To be told to fight in a war that you don't want to participate in or really know nothing about. To be told that you have to kill people in order to progress through this. To know that he may have to end up killing people dear to him. I really sympathize with him. After all, he is an high school kid. To have so much burden on his shoulders. Right now he's trying to figure out the best means possible to win, to walk his on path the best way possible. Although a bit nieve right now, I'm pretty sure that he will "wake up" when time is right.
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Old 12-02-2006, 03:16 PM   #32   [permalink]
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It's not a burden if it's something one creates on his own. You could say he has his values, and those keep him from going along with the flow, so to speak, in this holy grail war, but he's not doing anything but complaining and making outstanding demands. There's a difference between naivety and ignorance. It's almost as if he CHOOSES to remain ignorant on all that's around him, and that annoys me to no end. All he can say is "you got a problem with that?" instead of saying something more meaningful, like "I'm gonna do my best to figure something out" which is so common but at least it shows they have a will to change things.

I know I know, we're barely six eps in. I'm not saying he won't become this super-cool-solves-everything-pimp MC later on, but I'm just annoyed by how he is currently. Plus, he's witnessed the power of servants on several occasions, so he's definitely not ignorant to what they are capable of, yet he refuses to call Saber during the battle with Rider. Regardless of his "good boy" nature of having to care about using Saber, he thinks he can take Rider on himself? He thinks he should exhaust everything he can do BEFORE calling Saber? He thinks he can win (or draw)? That's not ignorance. That's not naivety. That's stupidity. That's why I hate him.

For now.

I'll be fair. It's only been six episodes. Actually, I started hating him around ep 3 so it's only been three eps. And, yes, he's a HS kid. Maybe something about him just rubs me the wrong way. Now that I'm in this mentality, it's hard to get out of it, heh.
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Old 12-02-2006, 04:43 PM   #33   [permalink]
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But really, can you blame him? It's like throwing a 6 year old kid in the deep part of a swimming pool whom has no experience swimming and just telling him to "swim". The chances of that boy swimming in the pool is very slim at best. I feel like Emiya is handling the situation the best way he sees it as he was basically thrusted into a middle of a war, well not just any war, but the Holy Grail War. He's just trying to keep afloat right now, but in the process he's pissing of people around him because he can't swim. It seems there is no right or wrong way to play this game right now and he's just trying to get a grasp of what's going on around him. You have to ask yourself this question: If you were Emiya, how would you handle the situation presented to you?
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Old 12-02-2006, 05:10 PM   #34   [permalink]
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I think your analogy is a bit off. It's more like throwing a 15-16 year old kid (whatever Emiya's age is) that doesn't know how to swim into the deep end of a pool. Yes, there's a difference. A 6 year old will most likely drown not just from lack of swimming experience but due to a lack of any experiences. They haven't quite developed the survival nor intuitive skills necessary to survive in such a dire situation.

In contrast, a mid-teen has a higher level of survival and intuitive skills and has a greater chance of surviving. Yes, there's no guarantee that they will, but the point is that they can, whereas a 6 year old has little to no chance.

Using this current analogy, if the mid-teen doesn't at least TRY to survive, he'll drown before anything can happen. If he at least learns to stay afloat for a little while longer, he can devise a method to finding a way out of his situation.

Emiya, in his current state of mind, is drowning. He's neither trying to prolong his survival, nor is he trying to figure out how to stay afloat. He even has someone on the side of the pool, with a life vest, that's yelling at him "anytime you want, I'll throw this to you" but Emiya doesn't ask for it (Saber).

With that out of the way, I do agree that he's been thrown into an unbelievable situation and is trying to figure what he needs to do. The part I'm annoyed by is that he doesn't seem like he's trying to figure things out (but we, as fans, know he will of course).

I won't go much more into my "hatin' on Emiya" nonsense. It's still too early to judge him. I'm just hatin' on the lack of drive so far, but I'm sure he'll change. They always change. I'll re-evaluate things then.

EDIT: Oops, I never answered your question. I have trouble answering "what if" questions, but I'll try this one. I'm a very logical and analytical person when I have time yet I'm very rash and blunt in normal circumstances. Given Emiya's current situation, I would be very decisive. WHAT I would decide is hard to say, since that's where my analytical and rash sides conflict (I have time now to think about it, but if I REALLY was in that situation, I wouldn't have that much time, but it's hard to "pretend" I don't have alot of time... get it?). The point is I would make choices. I can only presume I'd make choices based on my survival rate as well as those around me that I care for, but I really cannot say what I would do. Again, the point is I would do SOMETHING.

Would I fight? Yes, I would.
Would I kill? That's one question I can never answer.
Would I have immediately started learning about magic and done what I could to become as knowledgable as I can regarding magic, the holy grail war, masters, servants, and anything else that's relevant given this sudden change to my life, unlike Emiya? HELL YES.

Oops, sorry. I said I wouldn't bash on Emiya again. Last time, really.... until ep 7... heh.
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Old 12-02-2006, 05:38 PM   #35   [permalink]
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Hmm....fair enough. But still, he's trying to solve it the best way possible without get anyone hurt, even Saber, even Rider and all the other master and servants after him. He's trying to figure things out but things are constantly getting thrown at him left and right to where as he really has no time to analyze the situation. From the moment Lancer targeted him in episode two, his whole life became a battlefield. Bam, Berserker wants to kill him, Bam Rin wants to kill him, Bam Rider wants to kill him....I mean he really hasn't gotten a break at all. I'm pretty sure this is hard for him to digest properly right now realizing that every person is gunning after you since you're the weakest person in the game right now. It's a good thing that his body can recover quickly after fatal wounds.

I find him the most interesting person right now considering the fact that he's trying to walk the most dangerous path. It would be simple enough for him to just to call out Saber and have her open a can of whoop ass but he feels that there is a better way to do things. A way in which he thinks will benefit everyone. Yeah, he's very unique because he's going against the grain of how everyone feels about the War. He may be stubborn, but since he was thrown into this war, he's going to go about his on way on his own terms. That's what I like about him, his determination to walk his own path and not what everyone else thinks he should do.

One more thing....It seems your hate for Emiya is growing quickly!!! Don't worry, I have confidence he'll get better.
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Old 12-02-2006, 07:13 PM   #36   [permalink]
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Yeah yeah, I know he'll improve. It's kinda sorta inevitable with anime as this. I suppose there's a fine line between unwavering determination and supreme indecisiveness, and therein lies my hate.

Ahhh, to bring a more positiveness to this thread, I wantses more Rider. She's too pimp. It's like a hawt Scorpion (MK), hehe. Ok, that's only based on the lil bit of battle she had in ep 6. Okokok, I just wanted to call her a "hawt Scorpion", sue me. He was my fave char in MK, so the instant I saw that spear/chain combo, I thought of that.
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Old 18-02-2006, 07:09 PM   #37   [permalink]
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Finished up episode 7. I must say that Rin is truly an enigima. It seems like she's ready to stab Emiya in the back at any any moment. She's truly a wolf in sheep clothing. Nothing much really happened in this episode. Just Rin and Emiya trying to breakdown the force field at the school by destroying the spell marks. Later on Emiya finds out that Shinji is a master and Rider is his servant, which wasn't all too surprising to me.


I can now see how Emiya's aloofness and lackadasical attitude could frustrate some people. Even Saber got into his ass this episode!! He's really not a popular character in his part of town. But that what makes his character appealing. The fact he he's learning slowly and trying to find his own path. The problem I see here is that he's trying to please everyone which isn't going to work in this type of situation. Especially if Sakura turns out to be a Master, which I believe she is. To be honest, I think that Rin is more of the main character right now than Emiya.

A quick question to you guys: Has anyone here played the hentai game? Just curious.
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Old 19-02-2006, 05:31 AM   #38   [permalink]
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Really? I say much happened in this episode. In terms of action and the main story, no, nothing, but for the characters, we got to know a bit more about them.

I have a slightly higher opinion of Emiya now. He's more decisive after this episode (like chasing after Sakura and explaining things to her) but he says "nothing" and "but" too damn much... sorry. I had to pick something out hehe.

It was always presumed that Sakura liked Emiya, but at least now I can say for sure that she does... now I'd like to know why.

Rin was portrayed more with "human" emotions in this one. She was almost robotic in the past, but she's cracking down and even talking to Emiya as if they were on the same level now... of course, she still has that condescending tone.

I feel sorry for Saber. She gets no screen time. Rider will already get shafted since she's hooked up with a "villian" but Saber needs more! I wants my seiyuus in the limelight!

I tried to play the game but the program I used to translate JP text in these games didn't work too well and given that these games are dialogue heavy, not being able to read it is worthless to play.
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Old 19-02-2006, 07:42 AM   #39   [permalink]
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Ya still picking on Emiya hey!! Hmm...I thought that Sakura liking Emiya was pretty obvious from the start of episode one. She does cook for him after all and seems to be pretty giddy around him, so that wasn't a real surprise for me. What I'm wondering thought is she a Master and whom's her servant. I believe that Rin and Sakura can "sense" each other but neither one isn't really sure or being very secretive about it.


I'm telling you, I don't care how much emotions Rin shows she a frecking snake!! A Viper snake! It was nice to see her warm up to Emiya a little bit. But boy, is she quick to turn back to her sneaky self. I really consider her the "dark horse" of the Holy Grail War as she seems to posses the most knowledge out of all the masters we've seen so far.

As for Saber, I think Saber's screen time has been just right. She's not really a talkative person. Also there hasn't been alot of action, so the few times that we actually do see her, she truly shines. I almost positive she'll get more screen time as Emiya learns more about the War.

I definately like the feel and direction of the series. It's slowly unraveling itself and at the same time providing mystery and a lot of suspense. After this series is over, the sequel will be animated.
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Old 19-02-2006, 11:15 AM   #40   [permalink]
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Emiya is just so dense,it's not even funny.In episode seven,after being bashed by Berserker,stabbed by Rider,attacked by Rin and being defenseless and admitting himself he depends on Rin for survival and Rin warns him to go straight home.What does he do?Goes back to school by himself and doesn't even consider calling Rin or Saber.At this point I don't care Emiya's the hero of the story,he doesn't deserve to win the Holy Grail War.

But anyway I still like the series.Yes Rin is a viper,but that only adds to her charm

And it will ne interesting to see what Emiya's excuse to Saber will be for pulling such a stunt.After that nothing he or Rin can say will keep Saber home,she'll follow Emiya everywhere after that.
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Old 19-02-2006, 11:50 AM   #41   [permalink]
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Hahaha.. I told myself to lessen my bashing of Emiya and totally forgot about the fact that he went into that clubroom by himself. It's not so much that he's dense, cuz he knows he lacks skill and knowledge. He knows he's weak. It's pride. He's just conceited for some reason.

Sure, he's doing it so as to not trouble those around him, but I think part of it is his thinking that it'll work out in his favor. It's a baseless assumption but it seems he goes by it.

Anyway, in his defense, this situation may not turn out that bad since Shinji seems like he just wants to chit-chat... and even if it does, there's still the possibly he'll call on Saber when necessary. I'm doubtful on the latter, but I think the former will happen anyway so it's a moot point.
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Old 19-02-2006, 03:03 PM   #42   [permalink]
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I just realized...

I focus on the male MCs too much. Whether it's basic harem animes or just typical shounen romance or one's taken from bishoujo games... you figure it's the girls we should focus on right? They should be the one's to critique right? Or no? Cuz... I don't. To a degree, yes, but it's plainly obvious I pick apart the male MC way more then anything else.

I wonder if it's some sort of superiority complex. Alot of these male MCs are rather nondescript and flawed for a reason... I wonder if I'm playing into that.

Hahaha, my bad, I don't mean to derail this thread. I only chose it cuz it was the most recent anime of this type and of course, since I keep bashing on Emiya.

Just something I thought of while watching Canvas 2. Every episode, I kept making comments (to myself) regarding the male MC and suddenly it hit me. I barely had anything to say about the girls around him. Granted, the girls in Canvas 2 aren't all that exciting, but I won't use that as an excuse.

Just found it strange. It's not just me though right?

EDIT: Crap, meant to edit my last post not start a new one. It's too late for me, I didn't even notice. Oh well.
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Old 21-02-2006, 05:57 AM   #43   [permalink]
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All I can say is the person who summoned Saber has a twisted sense of humor, pairing her up with emiya. Its just telling her she is the most powerfull out there, but the jerk won't let her fight so she is in for one harsh time to come(going by the fight with Herakles), all this while being sucked away all of her energy by his constant foolishness.
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Old 26-02-2006, 04:44 AM   #44   [permalink]
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Watched episode 8. A lot of things happened this episode that I want to address. But the main point of the episode for me was Emiya's trust. He seems to have an abudance of him. For him to trust Shinji like that was amazing, although Shinji didn't lie about the temple, but still I could easily sense the evil in that boy. Another move that boggled the mind was letting Rin stay at his house? I understand that they are "working together" but why would you want a more powerful master to be staying at your house. Especially when you know she could take you out at any minute. Well, probably not since Saber is there which brings me to my big point here....

It seems that Emiya doesn't even trust his own servant!? Watching how he treated Saber in this episode, it was pretty obvious. She was offering sound advice, but he swatted them down time and time again. He trusts Shinji and Rin more, which are masters that eventually want to kill him, then his own servant whom is willing and able to fight for him. He really treated her pretty crappy. I felt a little bad for Saber this episode as she is trying her hardest to be servant, but Emiya keeps defeating the purpose of her existence....Finally Saber just took action on her own, calling Emiya nieve, which I think is true. The question is what is it going to take for Emiya to start trusting and believing in his own servant?

Boy, I'm starting to wonder if Emiya has a death wish or something? He's being nieve and trustworthy at the same time which are two deadly combinations. But again, hopefully this is just a phase and will end soon.
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Old 26-02-2006, 08:43 PM   #45   [permalink]
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Simply put,Emiya doesn't want anyone to die,much less ihs own servant.Of course he doesn't seem to realize that she's already dead,in a way,and the only reason she's there is to fight the Holy Grail War.

It's interesting to see more hints that Sakura is a Master.Of course Shinji said the Matou line has dried up and only the eldest son can inherit magical abilities,but in the world of animes all the main characters get special powers(Well except for Fuji but she's the comic relief).Wich will present a very interestin dilemma for them if it happens.Emiya's already reluctant to fight or even mistrust Rin,who will most likely kill Emiya when it becomes profitable.
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