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Old 11-08-2006, 01:34 PM   #1   [permalink]
The Creeper
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What do you think of short/OVA Anime?

This is a question that's bugged me since as far back as I can remember, but I always wondered how people felt about how certain animes are cut down to such a short, short amount of time. Animes that you REALLY enjoy but only have 13 or even a measley 6 episodes under it's belt.

Alot of the animes I watch and love are all OVA and it upsets me because I hate how they get you involved with a show, learning all the characters and getting deep into their story, just to cut it off without a proper ending after just 6 stinking episodes?

What I wanted to know is what do you guys think of animes that are short? Do you wish some of the 6 or 13 episode animes had been stretched out to make a full 26 episode series? Do you like them short? Not like them?
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Old 11-08-2006, 03:15 PM   #2   [permalink]
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Kind of mixed feelings really, I like the fact that the OVAs are usually more cost effective and thus help to enable producers on a limited budget to bring a story to tv (actually a fair number of times, the brevity of the series actually allows for higher production values while still costing less due to the fewer episodes)

... where it hurts, is when, like you, you really get into an OVA only to find that there is nothing beyond it ... kind of like getting a tiny sip of water when you are parched ...

Can't really see solution though, because much of the anime industry is based upon viewer ratings and responses ... that a series will usually last only as long as it maintains a certain minimum "nielson rating" of popularity ... drop below that and the show tanks.

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Old 11-08-2006, 04:52 PM   #3   [permalink]
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As long as a series (be it TV, OAV, or one shot) is well executed, then I feel that the length is irrelevant. My fave OAV is Gunbuster; it's an epic space opera, all neatly packaged into a 6 part series. The story telling is great, & the same is true for the 4 part Macross Plus OAV too. Neither of those series need to be any longer IMO, & more episodes doesn't always mean better, e.g., the Record of Lodoss War 13 part OAV series is a classic fantasy anime, it is superb, & tells the story in a succinct way, but the 27 episode TV series was a chore to watch to be honest, it has poor direction IMO & drags on & on & on.

Of course, there are series that I wished were longer; Gunsmith Cats, Battle Angel Alita (both canned because of low interest in Japan), & Kino's Journey (I just wanted more episodes to watch, heh) to name but a few. But on the flipside, there are long series that could do with some judicious pruning to make them flow better, eg., Noir (the poor pacing kinda ruins this show), Bubblegum Crisis 2040 (could have concluded a lot earlier), & Witch Hunter Robin (the plot seemed stretched thin to cover the requisite 26 episodes).
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Old 11-08-2006, 05:00 PM   #4   [permalink]
SamIam
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Originally Posted by EVA fiend
As long as a series (be it TV, OAV, or one shot) is well executed, then I feel that the length is irrelevant. My fave OAV is Gunbuster; it's an epic space opera, all neatly packaged into a 6 part series. The story telling is great, & the same is true for the 4 part Macross Plus OAV too. Neither of those series need to be any longer IMO, & more episodes doesn't always mean better, e.g., the Record of Lodoss War 13 part OAV series is a classic fantasy anime, it is superb, & tells the story in a succinct way, but the 27 episode TV series was a chore to watch to be honest, it has poor direction IMO & drags on & on & on.

Of course, there are series that I wished were longer; Gunsmith Cats, Battle Angel Alita (both canned because of low interest in Japan), & Kino's Journey (I just wanted more episodes to watch, heh) to name but a few. But on the flipside, there are long series that could do with some judicious pruning to make them flow better, eg., Noir (the poor pacing kinda ruins this show), Bubblegum Crisis 2040 (could have concluded a lot earlier), & Witch Hunter Robin (the plot seemed stretched thin to cover the requisite 26 episodes).

ahhh ... excellent examples ... I can't agree more on Gunnbuster and Macross Plus as being the reference standard for a well crafted self contained story. Which IMO makes GunnBuster even more amazing in that it covered so much "historical" ground and yet, pulled off a satisfying closure to the OVA.

Side note here, I think that MOST Series that extend for years i.e. the 52 /year cycle ... could be condensed considerably for the stories sake, but inertia, popularity and greed tend to seduce the producers into stretching and "milking" the series for all its worth.

... in this regard, I think the OVA has particular merit ... as in the saying "Less is more".
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Old 11-08-2006, 05:44 PM   #5   [permalink]
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Another reason for the popularity of 13 episode series (compared to 26) these days is that they're much cheaper to produce. If the anime becomes popular than they can produce another series just like what happened with Vandread.

A lot of series would do better as 13 episodes, FMP The Second Raid is a vast improvement over the original with a lack of filler eps being one of the main reasons. (Ping Pong AS from series 1 >.<)
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Old 11-08-2006, 07:52 PM   #6   [permalink]
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I dont really think much about it generally, and when I do its on a case by case basis. I would love to see more of almost every anime I've ever seen.

There are a few that I love that are very short and I really wish they would do more...Pet Shop of Horrors and FLCL spring to mind, although FLCL its hard to say...it was what it was and might not work as anything else.

Thats generally how I feel about short series, like Lain and Haibane Renmei...they are meant to be how they are, whereas then you have anime like Get Backers and Saiyuki that go on through many small story arcs, all of which are wonderful

It just depends.
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Old 11-08-2006, 09:18 PM   #7   [permalink]
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Well the truth of the matter is we can't really say the story was "finished" with these OVAs and that there is nothing left to say. Because, we don't know how good or bad these stories would be unless they were made.

You'll never know how good or bad something is until you try. I personally think it's annoying and down right frustrating because it gives you a sense of shallowness by leaving a series just wide open without any kind of conlusion.

Gunsmith Cats could have EASILY stretched out into a series, it's a simple show and it's got a good set of characters that are likeable and it's action packed. I also think Hellsing should have gotten more episodes, that show was TOO good to be cut off.

Some of my fav. animes are OVAs and it upsets me cause I know I'll more or less never seem em again. Most that come to mind are Ruin Explorers, All Purpose Cultural Cat Girl Nuku Nuku, Blue Seed 2, and Dirty Pair Flash.

I was REALLY upset how Flash wasn't finished, they made it up to 16 episodes, that's 3 more then the average 13 count. I loved that show and it burned me up knowing they had to drop it right there without a proper ending.

That's the biggest problem: closure. FLCL at least had a proper ending, if you're going to go to the work of creating characters and a story people are going to love and get involved with, the least you can do is end it properly.

Having an anime without a proper ending just leaves you disappointed.
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Old 11-08-2006, 09:20 PM   #8   [permalink]
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I know one time or another I've wished that "X" or "Y" anime ran for longer. Most recently would be Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya, not that I wasn't satisfied with its 14 episode run, I'm just greedy and want more, it also doesn't mean more episodes would be any good. But I know what you're getting at, sometimes you just don't feel satisfied with what you're given.

And as mentioned there are longer series that are riddled with filler and recap episodes. And that's not generally a good thing, it can really wear your patience down.
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Old 11-08-2006, 09:29 PM   #9   [permalink]
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Well the thing is, one of the things that kinda irks me about anime is that sometimes you wish certain things or certain characters were explored more. With American shows or movies, you have time to announce what you like and don't like.

Like if you really loved this character, the creators would listen and build up that character and do more. But with anime it's already done, printed, and sent out and you're stuck with whatever they have and that's about it.

I'm not saying anime has been gypping us all this time, but it would be nice to be able to generate a sort of feedback that would make a difference. The way I see it, if you're going to bother putting time, work, effort, and money into something.

You should see it through to the end. Not all OVAs need finishing (FLCL) comes to mind. But I think at the very least they should at least try and create a sense of "completion" at the end so you don't have that crappy feeling inside.
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Old 12-08-2006, 08:17 AM   #10   [permalink]
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Originally Posted by The Creeper
But I think at the very least they should at least try and create a sense of "completion" at the end so you don't have that crappy feeling inside.
Kare Kano (anime) comes to mind here, I'm sure many will agree.
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Old 13-08-2006, 10:19 AM   #11   [permalink]
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Quote:
Well the truth of the matter is we can't really say the story was "finished" with these OVAs and that there is nothing left to say. Because, we don't know how good or bad these stories would be unless they were made.

But what if they were never meant to be made?

The teller of the story is the one who decides when the story is finished. It may not be in a manner satisfactory to us, but it doesnt mean that it is unfinished.


Quote:
You'll never know how good or bad something is until you try. I personally think it's annoying and down right frustrating because it gives you a sense of shallowness by leaving a series just wide open without any kind of conlusion.

I've rarely seen anime with no conclusion at all. Many of them have endings that are somewhat inconclusive and/or confusing, but thats true for series of all lengths, and has to do I think more with the differences between Eastern and Western storytelling.

Eva and RahXephon for instance are 26 episode series with endings that many consider inconclusive, even with a movie to finish them off as well.


Quote:
Having an anime without a proper ending just leaves you disappointed.

But who defines what a "proper" ending is?



Quote:
I was REALLY upset how Flash wasn't finished, they made it up to 16 episodes, that's 3 more then the average 13 count. I loved that show and it burned me up knowing they had to drop it right there without a proper ending.

If a series gets started and then gets cancelled before it can finish, that of course is a different thing and I can certainly agree that that would be extremely irritating.
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Old 13-08-2006, 12:21 PM   #12   [permalink]
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THe couple OVA series ive seen wasnt that great.
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Old 14-08-2006, 09:26 AM   #13   [permalink]
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Originally Posted by The Creeper
Gunsmith Cats could have EASILY stretched out into a series, it's a simple show and it's got a good set of characters that are likeable and it's action packed. I also think Hellsing should have gotten more episodes, that show was TOO good to be cut off.
The now original Hellsing anime was 'cut off' probably because firstly, the story diverges somewhat from the manga after the conclusion of the Valentine brothers, the story arks towards Incognito to create that 'final battle' sequence whereby he exists to cut this story short and er.. do it in a dramatic, flashy fashion.. blood everywhere etc.

Btw the new Hellsing, Hellsing Ultimate which has just released the first episodiac/volume, follows the manga faithfully and so will be longer and will not have any abrupt endings... unless Hirano decides otherwise as the manga is ongoing. *crosses fingers*


Originally Posted by The Creeper
That's the biggest problem: closure. FLCL at least had a proper ending, if you're going to go to the work of creating characters and a story people are going to love and get involved with, the least you can do is end it properly.
*spoilers for Hikaru no Go*

Hikaru no Go comes to mind. The anime is sooo long (75 episodes.. but I guess I cant complain when you compare it to people who watch Naruto or err Bleach?) Even with the 2004 special extra edition extra whatever, it leaves alot to be desired. ...Will Hikaru ever surpass Touya, will Sai ever come back other than as a Chibi extra on wait for it 'more specials' and what about the 'divine move'; not to mention the semi-movie 2004 special revolving around who will enter the finals overseas, not the matches themselves but the preliminaries... oh and Touya is automatically in cause hes just too good Yes its wanting and there is no more, but I cant be sure as I havent read much of the manga.





Oh and closer to topic, Metal Angel Marie/My Dear Marie is only a 1 OVA 3 part anime (again not sure of the manga, it just appeared in the video store) and its wonderfull, balanced and because of that its very much a rewatchable.

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Old 14-08-2006, 11:11 AM   #14   [permalink]
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Oh yes this topics has surface a few latent emotions. Would Berserk fit in here? What about Dual Adventures? If its a complete OVA or atleast one that has some kind of ending, unlike the following:

Madara! Bastard!!! Ninja Cadets! Black Lion!!! Battle Angel!!! I can keep going or is this enough?

RG Veda, Ninku... Some already covered Gunbuster! Im not sure if the Battle angel Im talking about is the same one as Eva Feind, but I read somewhere that it will be picked back up

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Old 14-08-2006, 02:34 PM   #15   [permalink]
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What I meant Merlion is that "proper" ending means just having some sort of conclusion, having a sense that you know it's over or at least something has been accomplished. Even if the story wasn't "meant" to go any further that doesn't necessarily mean that it can't go further.

The Terminator movie series for example had it's story "told" after number 2. But it was able to continue with Rise of the machines, now even if though that was a different director, the point is that a story can be continued. And even if I may not be as good as it was when it started, you can't tell unless you try.

The reason I say this is because it hurts me that when you watch these characters and they start to grow on you, you feel a bit bitter knowing how far they got and knowing this is all you're ever going to have of them. Now in regards to cancellation, I thought "Flash" was just an OVA and not a series.

I thought that's why it did end where it did, but even that confused me because it ended after 16 episodes which isn't a common number. Usually it's 13 or 6 or something.
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